Damn, accident, and check this out

wee96 · Post by **wee96** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 1:53 pm

I got hit this morning on the way to work. Check the whole story out, and let me know what you guys think and/or would do:

I came up to the intersection, has a left turn lane, a middle lane that has a forward and right turn arrow in it, and then to the right of that is parking, although about 1 1/2 car length of space at the intersection where you cannot park, no yellow markings to indicate you cannot use that to turn, no signs, etc. I stop at the white line there, waiting for green. The light turns green, I am not moving yet, a guy in the middle lane turns and smacks into my left front bumper, killing the bumper and turn signal, as well as the front fender somewhat. He managed to, even obviously after hearing you hit something, keep driving and it scraped all the way down the right side of his truck, remember im still not moving, im stopped. He calmly called the police, as well I was calm, hey I figured this guy hit me, and he knows it so there was no hostility from either of us.

The cop shows up, surveys the damage, takes our papers, after about 10 minutes he comes back, first to the guy in the truck, not sure what they exchanged but anyway, then he comes up to me. He gives me a ticket for improper lane useage, saying thats a parking lane (wtf, you cant park there!) and on the ticket he wrote "driver used parking lane to turn, struck other vehicle while turning". WTF? I told him "I wasnt moving, how can you give me a ticket?" He just basically ignored me and gave me the info about where to call, etc.

First things first, I didnt know you could get a ticket for SOMEONE ELSE hitting you while your NOT MOVING! If in fact this area is not allowed for turning, it should be painted off with yellow lines, its not. The ticket I was given costs more than a 10mph over speeding ticket, and is 2 points! A 10mph over ticket is 1 point, can you believe this? I am going to lose my insurance because someone else hit me and a cop gave me a ticket for not doing anything wrong (granted I know now that its a "parking lane" although everyone turns in the space I did, and like I said its not marked off or any signs detailing this).

My father somewhat knows this cop and was quite angry, im not sure what hes going to do if hes going to talk to him first or what. I am definately fighting the ticket, ill be taking pictures of the intersection, of my car, in detail explaining how I was struck and that the cop wrote down that I struck the other vehicle when I wasnt even moving, HE struck ME. I talked to a retired policeman from this city and he said alot of the cops there dont even show up for court, so maybe ill just get lucky and he wont show up. If he does, he better explain why he wrote that I struck someone when it was THEM who struck me. I am not paying $95 for a ticket when I didnt do anything, and now I probably have $1200 or so worth of damage to my car that progressive is NOT going to be happy with (someone hit me about 6 months ago in that same spot, ironic eh?) and they will surely cancel me as a customer. My rates are going to go insanely high, this is complete and total BS!

Should I sue the other driver for deductable and insurance premium damages? I am very, VERY angry, I feel that I was blamed because I was younger (the other guy was probably about 40, the cop was probably the same age too, and I think they knew each other). Anyone with any law experience or knowledge about fighting tickets id love to hear your advice.

MadDoctor · Post by **MadDoctor** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 1:56 pm

A witness would be nice.

wee96 · Post by **wee96** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 1:57 pm

Originally posted by MadDoctor
A witness would be nice.

Unfortunately it was early in the morning, all the people who saw it basically drove away, no idea who they are.

Joint Chiefs of Staff · Tue Feb 17, 2004 1:58 pm

Originally posted by wee96
Anyone with any law experience or knowledge about fighting tickets id love to hear your advice.

And this is where RoundEye steps in.

Spicer · Post by **Spicer** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:12 pm

Tmmrw.....Take a picture of the intersection and the marking lines..??

Post it....I.m not siding with the cop...I just can't see him making that big of a mistake...

Let's have a look at the pic...It's hard to see the actual placement from your description...

Spice

wee96 · Post by **wee96** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:31 pm

Here is the intersection, where the red car is at is where he was, see the space to the right? I was there, at the white line, if youll notice theres nothing painted to block that space off, its not a parking spot, the last parking spot is behind it, the marker in blue for the handicapped spot. I didnt move from that spot, he turned into me, how can that possibly be my fault?

Zilog B · Post by **Zilog B** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:39 pm

What I think it boils down to is this. Was he waiting at the light, and then you went to the right of him to turn right? Or were your waiting to turn right, then he pulled up to the left of you. Whoever arrived 2nd to that light is in the wrong, that is only one lane. But he did strike a non-moving vehicle, sometimes that is what they look at. You can still fight the ticket, but for that small amount of damage I'm sure your insurance company will just cut a check and be done with it.

Spicer · Post by **Spicer** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:40 pm

I doubt it.....

The Right Turn Lane is clearly marked.....As is the No Parking Zone Sign....Which as you see goes further than the Parking Line...

It would seem to me the cop would think..You were in a hurry and disregarded the Turn Lane Sign on the pavement...Especially since the Handicapped Sign goes almost to the corner...Most likely for Buses or Larger Handicapped Vehicles....

Try It Out....Ya might beat it..Who Knows

Spice

Prey521 · Post by **Prey521** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:42 pm

OK, I think I see where the cop might think it's your fault, even if you were not moving......is there a divider between that "middle" lane where that Camaro is and the left lane? I see no divider between the middle lane and the lane at which you were stopped......that blue Handicap parking marker, is that entire lane there for behind that spot for parking also? If it is, it may be that even though it's clear, that lane is really not for turning. I see peeps here in the city do that all the time, creep up into a little spot in the right lane to make that turn. I may be wrong, but technically, even if he did hit you, you're not supposed to be turning from that lane, I hope I'm wrong though!

Loonatic · Post by **Loonatic** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:48 pm

But he didnt move, he was standing. Nothing said he couldnt stand.

Spicer · Post by **Spicer** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:51 pm

Originally posted by Loonatic
But he didnt move, he was standing. Nothing said he couldnt stand.

Hadicapped parking means....You shouldn,t be there without a Handicapped Sticker...

Standing/Laying/Sitting..From the Telephone Pole Back!

Besides that the arrow on the pavement says very clearly...(Right Turns From This Lane).....

Spice

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:55 pm

I say fight it cuz you werent moving, but it is clearly marked that its parking and not a lane u can use to turn.

But still, getting a tickect for HITTING HIM is a stretch. I would think a warning to you to not use that lane in the future would be enough, but then I'm not a cop...

Best of luck!

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:56 pm

Originally posted by Spicer
Hadicapped parking means....You shouldn,t be there without a Handicapped Sticker...

Standing/Laying/Sitting..From the Telephone Pole Back!

Besides that the arrow on the pavement says very clearly...(Right Turns From This Lane)..... Spice

so then wee should get a $100 handicap fine and the guy charged with hitting wee.

wee96 · Post by **wee96** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:57 pm

Uhh people, that handicapped spot is IN FRONT of that sign, marked in blue, BEHIND the sign is not a parking spot, its illegal to park there as your too close to an intersection, yes the arrows are in the middle lane, that means nothing other than you are allowed to turn or keep going. That spot I was in is clearly for people who are parked in the handicapped space to pull up to the intersection, I was in that space waiting for the light, I did nothing wrong. Parking signs go in FRONT of the space they advertise.....also notice the notches on the blue paint, point back towards the space indicating the space is behind, not in front of the sign.

Spicer · Post by **Spicer** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:01 pm

and right turn arrow in it, and then to the right of that is parking, although about 1 1/2 car length of space at the intersection where you cannot park, no yellow markings to indicate you cannot use that to turn, no signs, etc. Your Quote!

That sign on the pavement says....*RIGHT TURNS FROM THIS LANE ONLY*...ONLY!!

Cheers Bud.....Like I said.....You might be able to do something...Who Knows....

Spice

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:04 pm

Originally posted by wee96
Uhh people, that handicapped spot is IN FRONT of that sign... ...Parking signs go in FRONT of the space they advertise

well which is it?

and either way I dont think what happened is right, but you werent in a lane anyway you look at it.

Spicer · Post by **Spicer** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:06 pm

Originally posted by YARDofSTUF
well witch is it?

and either way I dont think what happened is right, but you werent in a lane anyway you look at it.

Right....It's a two lane intersection....With a Handicapped Parking Lane on the right

Spice

Paft · Post by **Paft** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:07 pm

That's not technically a parking spot though, is it Spicer? So it would make sense that that could be used for turning.. there's no sign or indication that explicitly states "no turning allowed". Then again, I am a new driver and am likely wrong..

Wee, go to court and fight it. It will never hurt you to do so, persay. And you might have a reduced ticket / cop no-show. *shrugs*

Spicer · Post by **Spicer** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:07 pm

Originally posted by Paft
That's not technically a parking spot though, is it Spicer? So it would make sense that that could be used for turning.. there's no sign or indication that explicitly states "no turning allowed". Then again, I am a new driver and am likely wrong..

Wee, go to court and fight it. It will never hurt you to do so, persay. And you might have a reduced ticket / cop no-show. *shrugs*

That sign on the pavement means..*Right Turns Form This Lane Only*..

Spice

Paft · Post by **Paft** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:09 pm

Originally posted by Spicer
That sign on the pavement means..*Right Turns Form This Lane Only*.. Spice

a middle lane that has a forward and right turn arrow in it

That's the catch that gets me. That signal means that you can use the lane for thru traffic OR right turns. Not explicit.

You're probally right though.

Spicer · Post by **Spicer** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:11 pm

I'm the Cop.....I travel up to the Scene..I appraise the situation...I say...

Here's a Guy who doesn't want to wait his turn at the traffice signal.....Here's a guy who disobeys!!!....The road sign stating right turns from this lane only...Here's a guy who tries to Sneak Up on the right side to try and get around or in front of those OBEYING the law and waiting their turn to make the right...

Now....I'm bettin $50.00 Bucks that cop thought those words exactly..LOL!!

He would most likely be correct...Except you say that's NOT the way it happened....

Good Luck

Spice

Spicer · Post by **Spicer** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:12 pm

Originally posted by Paft
That's the catch that gets me. That signal means that you can use the lane for thru traffic OR right turns. Not explicit.

You're probally right though.

You're right..You can either Go Straight Or Turn Right Only from this lane...

There is No Middle Lane there.....2 Lanes..And a handicapped parking area.

Cheers Bud

Spice

Zilog B · Post by **Zilog B** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:13 pm

see, that middle lane with the forward and right turn arrow on it? It's actually the right lane, not the middle lane.

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:13 pm

Originally posted by Paft
That's the catch that gets me. That signal means that you can use the lane for thru traffic OR right turns. Not explicit.

You're probally right though.

ya it looks to be straight or right. it doesnt say only anywhere.

The spot in front of the handicapped parking should be because a car cant park closer than 1-2 car links to an intersection, light, or stop sign.

I've got my Drivers Ed book out. Any other questions?

Spicer · Post by **Spicer** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:15 pm

Originally posted by schlurpee
see, that middle lane with the forward and right turn arrow on it? It's actually the right lane, not the middle lane.

There Ya Go....

Spice

Paft · Post by **Paft** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:16 pm

Originally posted by YARDofSTUF
ya it looks to be straight or right. it doesnt say only anywhere.

The spot in front of the handicapped parking should be because a car cant park closer than 1-2 car links to an intersection, light, or stop sign.

I've got my Drivers Ed book out. Any other questions?

Your Driver's Ed book covered that? Wow, more extensive than mine is. :P

Thanks, though, YoS and Spicer.

Much more clear.

binksfan · Post by **binksfan** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:19 pm

Wee........

Go take another pic from farther back away from the intersection. Think I understand what you are saying and that is the forward end of the handicap pkg stall in the current pic. Also snap the pic when no car is parked on that arrow to show that it is straight ahead/or right turn and not a right turn only arrow. That red Camaro in the pic is clearly going straight thru and not waiting to turn right. I think you got a good case if you take wider angle pic., if you were in fact stopped behind that line. If you were moving forwards or over that white line then you were impeding the other drivers right to make a right turn from the legal lane.

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:21 pm

Originally posted by Paft
Your Driver's Ed book covered that? Wow, more extensive than mine is. :P

Thanks, though, YoS and Spicer. Much more clear.

This thing from SEARS driving school is 217 pages lol

It covers the 1-2 car links from sign light or intersection part.

Blisster · Post by **Blisster** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:31 pm

I think you should get a ticket for illegally parking in a handicapped spot (no points) and he should be cited for hitting a parked vehicle.

waferdog · Post by **waferdog** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:31 pm

Wee, first off, considering paying a lawyer who specializes in traffic law to take your case. It could be worth it.

From what I can see, at the very minimum, the other driver should at least share fault in this instance. He obviously was not paying attention to the area he was turning into. Had you been a pedestrian, he would have some major problems right now.

Were you behind the white 'stop' line when he hit you? If so, it also fair to say that he would have hit any car that actually would have been parked in that spot.

Further, you may want to have a lawyer consider whether this intersection / parking section is legally marked. There are rules that need to be followed when applying these traffic signals, and if they do not follow the law, that is another out.

Beyond a wideangle shot of the intersection, you may also want to draw a simple little picture showing an overhead view of the action. This could also help in determining the situation.

Waferdog

Kip Patterson · Post by **Kip Patterson** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:46 pm

Who arrived at the light first - you or him?

If he was there first, you would seem to have no right ot pull up where you did. If you were there first, he should have regarded you as a careless driver - too far to the right - and stayed behind you. mY guess is that he was there first.

In either case he had a duty to avoid hitting you, assuming he knew you were there. I think it's reasonable to expect that he had no idea you were there where you shouldn't have been.

Doesn't look ggod for the home team, sorry.

CiscoKid · Post by **CiscoKid** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 4:39 pm

looks to like depending the angle of your van, you may have hat a parked car getting into that area had a car been parked in the handicapped space directly behind where you claim to have been. in that case, I can see where the ticket is justified. However, had someone been illegaly parked, he would have hit a parked car and int hat case, he too should be cited

wee96 · Post by **wee96** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 6:23 pm

I was behind the white line, I did not move, he hit me, again I was still not moving. If I was in an illegal turn, there needs to be proper postings (an arrow in the middle with an arrow front and right means you can turn OR go straight, it doesnt mean you HAVE to turn there, thats why they have turn only arrows) and there are no postings or markings stopping someone from being there. Since I was hit in that spot, that means HE turned into that spot, meaning if I was in an illegal spot, so was he. He hit me, failure to yield. The cop did not ask me what happened, nor listen to me when I said I wasnt even moving. I am considering a lawyer because this is basically biased on my age and sex for one, just as spicer has explained I was viewed as someone rushing and trying to get ahead of everyone else and breaking the law, when I was actually just sitting there waiting for the turn like everyone always does in that spot. My parents have lived in this city for decades and have always turned there, I could setup a camera and get plenty of video of people doing it, this doesnt mean its RIGHT or LEGAL, it means theres nothing to say its ILLEGAL so people will stop.

How can it be my fault that he didnt know I was there? Id like to know the answer to that, you are always supposed to look before you go, first rule in driving.

Last thing, how can you say I wasnt in the lane when there is no line between where he was and where I was? Looks like one big lane to me. Fact is, I can accept being in the wrong place, thats fine and I will take that penalty (although its not marked properly) but this person hit ME, I was not moving, I cannot be held responsible for someone else hitting me, thats just plain stupid. The cop wrote on the ticket that I took the turn and hit the other guy, this is where the MAJOR problem is.....he didnt listen to me when I said I wasnt moving, he only listened to the other guy explain the situation and didnt ask me. I told him when he was handing me the ticket, because I was completely shocked and outraged, although I did it calmly.

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 6:55 pm

Originally posted by wee96
If I was in an illegal turn, there needs to be proper postings

Its marked properly and for you it was an illegal turn, CUZ YOU WEREN'T IN A LANE. That white line for the parking spot tells you that.

koldchillah · Post by **koldchillah** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 7:09 pm

Originally posted by wee96
an arrow in the middle with an arrow front and right means you can turn OR go straight, it doesnt mean you HAVE to turn there, thats why they have turn only arrows

I can't speak for your state, but in Florida if they mark the road with an arrow in that lane, that means it is THE ONLY lane you can use to go straight or turn right; otherwise they wouldn't bother marking it at all and it would be regarded as a middle lane instead.

Another thing I don't get is how did he turn into you if you were behind the line? I'll take your word for it, but it sounds like if your car wasn't there he would have plowed right over the sidewalk and either hopped a couple of curbs or crashed into the building there due to how sharp his turn must have been.

Either way, fight it man... the other guy shouldn't get off so easily.

Zilog B · Post by **Zilog B** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 7:11 pm

Originally posted by Kip Patterson
Who arrived at the light first - you or him?

This is the question we need answered.

vinnie · Post by **vinnie** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 7:38 pm

You weren't meant to be turning from there. You tried to.

There's a very good reason why you're not supposed to turn from places where you're not supposed to turn. I think you may have just found that out.

The moral is don't do illegal things in the future. Doesn't matter who was right or wrong in the accident on a moral ground, you were doing something illegal, paid the price to your car, to your liscence, to your insurance and from your wallet.

Maybe you'll think twice before doing illegal things in the future

CiscoKid · Post by **CiscoKid** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 7:49 pm

Originally posted by schlurpee
This is the question we need answered.

Yep, and untill he answers it, it really sounds like he was n the wrong.

Like I said in my post, it all depends on the angle of his car and who was there first

wee96 · Post by **wee96** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 7:50 pm

Originally posted by schlurpee
This is the question we need answered.

How am I supposed to know if he was there first or not? I wasnt looking at him until he started turning and I saw he was headed for the front edge of my car, then it was too late.

wee96 · Post by **wee96** » Tue Feb 17, 2004 7:55 pm

Originally posted by koldchillah
I can't speak for your state, but in Florida if they mark the road with an arrow in that lane, that means it is THE ONLY lane you can use to go straight or turn right; otherwise they wouldn't bother marking it at all and it would be regarded as a middle lane instead.

Another thing I don't get is how did he turn into you if you were behind the line? I'll take your word for it, but it sounds like if your car wasn't there he would have plowed right over the sidewalk and either hopped a couple of curbs or crashed into the building there due to how sharp his turn must have been.

Either way, fight it man... the other guy shouldn't get off so easily.

The sidewalk borders the turn, technically my front bumper was ON the big white line, but not over it. He took the turn sort of like a semi truck takes them, and hit me with the side of his truck, make sense?

SG Broadband Community

Damn, accident, and check this out

Damn, accident, and check this out

Re: Damn, accident, and check this out

You Might Beat It...

I came up to the intersection, has a left turn lane, a middle lane that has a forward

Scenario.....