Originally posted by Norm I'm curious about that too David, possibly because those are controversial subjects, not yet seen as illegal in the masses. I don't think having mp3's on a PC is illegal here in Canada, not sure though. But having them, and distributing them is 2 different stories.
What's the rules there DH, what does SG staff think about that?
As you well know, you are in your right to make a duplicate of software for your own single computer use. Music is similar, however copying seems permissible for the use on an other system in a person's possession (Taping albums for car stereo use...). The recording industry exacted their pound of flesh from tape sales (I wonder if they are claiming any cash from portable MP3 players). Software and hardware system exist to create legitimate MP3 copies for personal use. Broadband has skewed the tables wildly. Justify their existences all we wish, but Kazaa and it's kin are chiefly arteries for wholesale music piracy. We may have differing opinions on the industry itself, however as it stands, the exchange of Mp3's is bootlegging.
Cracking sites can give legitimate advice as well. It is nice not to require rooting for a cd in order to play a game. Still, we know why they exist.
shant,
david
PS... pardon the quick editting.... my eyes are a bit tired
Originally posted by BIGJIMSLATE A program like Kazaa or WinMX can be used to distribute files, whatever those may be. Perhaps UOD, or even Brent, want people to hear their music over those networks. I've found plenty of good indie artists that freely distribute their own works over these P2P applications.
Websites and forums are probably superior venues to self promotion of music.
You are probably right about copyrighted music/mp3's being illegal (unless of course you own the original) My mind has been clouded by the widespread common practice of sharing mp3's. It's everywhere.
As BJ pointed out though, there are many bands allowing thier music to be distributed free of charge.
P2P sharing apps have a dual purpose, and will likely in the future be forced to either stop alltogether, or stick to allowing the sharing of legit, freeware/shareware types of files only.
How that will be achieved, I have no idea. It won't be an easy task.
Originally posted by nightowl anybody have a serial for windows 3.11
I do know your jesting, but I'd like to point out that I think that 3.11 is now in the public domain as Microsoft has quit supporting it. Someone else may point out the error of my thinking if I'm wrong.
Originally posted by Norm You are probably right about copyrighted music/mp3's being illegal (unless of course you own the original) My mind has been clouded by the widespread common practice of sharing mp3's. It's everywhere.
As BJ pointed out though, there are many bands allowing their music to be distributed free of charge.
P2P sharing apps have a dual purpose, and will likely in the future be forced to either stop altogether, or stick to allowing the sharing of legit, freeware/shareware types of files only.
How that will be achieved, I have no idea. It won't be an easy task.
I agree that mp3 exchange is so ubiquitous, it appears legitimate.
Many bands approve of MP3 exchange to the chagrin of the record companies to which they are sign. If they sign to a label, the label has the right to decide modality of distribution.
P2P applications should be allowed based on freedom of information. However, like bars during prohibition, they will hold notoriety for their illegal activity.
Originally posted by nightowl anybody have a serial for windows 3.11
Actually I think there should be an exception to these rules for any Microsoft product, since the company is practically based on illegal practices itself.
Originally posted by torsten Actually I think there should be an exception to these rules for any Microsoft product, since the company is practically based on illegal practices itself.
all I can say is this, in the majority of cases, piracy and "warez" products are unethical in many ways, but sometimes, the cause is very just. But your all right, I apologize if I offended anyone by reaching out for help, I will not do so again.
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Originally posted by terrancelam all I can say is this, in the majority of cases, piracy and "warez" products are unethical in many ways, but sometimes, the cause is very just. But your all right, I apologize if I offended anyone by reaching out for help, I will not do so again.
It is an open discussion on a germane topic.
Would you care to elaborate on how the cause for piracy is just? Is it that software is too expensive? Are consumers being cheated?
when the cost of software is more then that of a complete set of hardware, i.e a computer, then there is obviously something seriously wrong, especially when the software is priced for "educational' use. Though this "Robin Hood" idea might not appeal to you, its how people who can't afford to pay the man his money will deal with the situation. Another thing of what I find is that, if your not using the software to general income of any sort and don't even plan on doing so and only plan on using it for learning purposes, how can it be a crime to be trained to use a persons software so that when you do put the knowledge of it to use, it will later generate income for that company ( through the purchasing of the product by the employees firm and continued usage of the product)? Granted a great deal of people don't want to ever buy a product because they don't believe in supporting it, I will buy software and games, because I want them to keep on producing and improving their product. I don't buy it out of loyalty or ethics, I buy because I need it. But if I can't afford it and I do need it to further my education, what can a person be asked to do?
Intel Core 2 Duo Q8300 2.55Ghz (1333mhz)
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EVGA 460GTX 1gb PCIE 2.0
Western Digital Black 640gb x 2 Raid 0
Coolermaster 1000W Modular PSU
Antec NSK4480B
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Originally posted by Deus ex Machina It is an open discussion on a germane topic.
Would you care to elaborate on how the cause for piracy is just? Is it that software is too expensive? Are consumers being cheated?
shant,
david
And to answer your question of the price of consumer level software. Yes and no. The market is flooded with games, each costing about $50USD and $75CAD, with so many out there competition is fierce and prices get dropped within a few week to a reasonable price.
I know your going to argue that for Commercial software, they don't appeal to a large enough audience to generate the volume of profit that a simple game would, so they charge for the niche market. But how can it be fair to the consumer who has to purchase the software at the commerical price, just because the company doesn't feel like adapting to small business or personal consumers? I can see why some software companies charge their premium for their product when its being used by a large corporation with more then 10 employees, but when it comes to a single user paying such a large price and fee, whats the point to that? Why isn't the pricing scaled towards usage and not just one large massive fee? A single person using the software can earn only so much, compare to a large corporation with multiple employees.
Intel Core 2 Duo Q8300 2.55Ghz (1333mhz)
Asus P5N-D
OCZ Platinum 8gb (2x2gb) PC8000 1000mhz 5-5-5-18
EVGA 460GTX 1gb PCIE 2.0
Western Digital Black 640gb x 2 Raid 0
Coolermaster 1000W Modular PSU
Antec NSK4480B
Windows 7 Professional 64-bit
----------------------------------------------------------
HP TC5700 (Thin Client) 1ghz, 512mb 80gb 1x1000mb NIC 1x100mb NIC running PFSense 1.22
Linksys WRT-150 running DD-WRT V.24 (Access Point)
Thats the main question. And yes we are being cheated. Why? Because, though the corporation is supposed to generate as much profit as possible, the main idea/role of the corporation is to serve the population, not the other way around. Though it may not seem like it, they too have a responcibility to the public and must trying to act as closely to their role as they can, or they should face punishment. We may live in a capitalistic society, but it is also a democratic one and the well being of all must be respected.
Intel Core 2 Duo Q8300 2.55Ghz (1333mhz)
Asus P5N-D
OCZ Platinum 8gb (2x2gb) PC8000 1000mhz 5-5-5-18
EVGA 460GTX 1gb PCIE 2.0
Western Digital Black 640gb x 2 Raid 0
Coolermaster 1000W Modular PSU
Antec NSK4480B
Windows 7 Professional 64-bit
----------------------------------------------------------
HP TC5700 (Thin Client) 1ghz, 512mb 80gb 1x1000mb NIC 1x100mb NIC running PFSense 1.22
Linksys WRT-150 running DD-WRT V.24 (Access Point)
Originally posted by terrancelam Thats the main question. And yes we are being cheated. Why? Because, though the corporation is supposed to generate as much profit as possible,
If you owned a company, would you not try to maximize your profits?
the main idea/role of the corporation is to serve the population, not the other way around.
I strongly disagree. Corporations are not social services that the populace pays into.
Though it may not seem like it, they too have a responcibility to the public and must trying to act as closely to their role as they can, or they should face punishment. We may live in a capitalistic society, but it is also a democratic one and the well being of all must be respected.
Aside from adhering to the law (Paying taxes, environmental issues etc), what do you believe are the limits of any companies responsibility? Do these responsibilities apply to single person or small organizations (Independant subcontractors, professionals, consultants etc..)
Originally posted by terrancelam when the cost of software is more then that of a complete set of hardware, i.e a computer, then there is obviously something seriously wrong, especially when the software is priced for "educational' use. Though this "Robin Hood" idea might not appeal to you, its how people who can't afford to pay the man his money will deal with the situation. Another thing of what I find is that, if your not using the software to general income of any sort and don't even plan on doing so and only plan on using it for learning purposes, how can it be a crime to be trained to use a persons software so that when you do put the knowledge of it to use, it will later generate income for that company ( through the purchasing of the product by the employees firm and continued usage of the product)? Granted a great deal of people don't want to ever buy a product because they don't believe in supporting it, I will buy software and games, because I want them to keep on producing and improving their product. I don't buy it out of loyalty or ethics, I buy because I need it. But if I can't afford it and I do need it to further my education, what can a person be asked to do?
I am not clean handed. Heck I have shop lifted as a child, but that does not make it any less a theft. You may very well support developers with your purchases, but a majority still feel justified in not doing so. Why should a specialty program like Photoshop be on nearly every hobbiests computer?
Perhaps if we were to demonstrate the talent and time that goes into making a software product, viewpoints might be altered.
I wonder how many small companies folded or were crushed by M$ because of revenue losses.
Originally posted by terrancelam Thats the main question. And yes we are being cheated. Why? Because, though the corporation is supposed to generate as much profit as possible, the main idea/role of the corporation is to serve the population, not the other way around. Though it may not seem like it, they too have a responcibility to the public and must trying to act as closely to their role as they can, or they should face punishment. We may live in a capitalistic society, but it is also a democratic one and the well being of all must be respected.
huh?
sounds like a communist!!
The only purpose of a company is to MAKE MONEY. Why else do people go to work... sure a little for the FUN of it, but let's be realistic about it.
Yes, I have a couple of them. Latest versions, too!
But I bought XP pro and I've decided to hang on to my OS/2 rights, 'cause I'm thinkin' I'm gonna need some way to boot up the computers around this place.
At least the install asks you if you would like to format the C: drive before the install begins! ;-)
The only purpose of a company is to MAKE MONEY. Why else do people go to work... sure a little for the FUN of it, but let's be realistic about it.
I think it's reasonable to expect a company to be responsible for their product ethically and morally. if everyone was in it just to MAKE MONEY, we'd have more cigarette companies around here killing people off by the thousands. Look just because you don't agree with my not so capitalist vision, doesn't mean that I'm a communist. Of course I believe that they should be making money, but they also should have to be responsible as to how they earn that money and to the people they sell it to. i am shocked though that you of all people would say something like that.
As for being realistic, when a company markets themselves toward the goal of money only, it results in a negative action(i.e warez). If they choose to not be morally and ethically obligated to their customers (both current and potential) then they'll face actions like people "warez"ing their products and sometimes even more harsh actions, like lawsuits and public protests. I'm not saying al companies/corporations have this orientation, I'm just saying that there are a few out there who's only goal is to generate money, through any means neccessary. That is the worst case scenario, but I'm just hopign that my ideas will rub off on someone and they'll decided that companies need to be responsible to the public.
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Asus P5N-D
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EVGA 460GTX 1gb PCIE 2.0
Western Digital Black 640gb x 2 Raid 0
Coolermaster 1000W Modular PSU
Antec NSK4480B
Windows 7 Professional 64-bit
----------------------------------------------------------
HP TC5700 (Thin Client) 1ghz, 512mb 80gb 1x1000mb NIC 1x100mb NIC running PFSense 1.22
Linksys WRT-150 running DD-WRT V.24 (Access Point)
Wait a second I thought I was the Criminal Mastermind here..
For all thoses who wanted to steal cars.. I'll have them shipped to you
For the pirates.. Rock on keep stealing destroy big business
"I cant do it by myself, I need everyone of you to open your computers to Illegal material"
Nothing to see here carry on
There Is only the Here and The Now, If you forget about that You might as well be Dead!
Originally posted by ExarKun For the pirates.. Rock on keep stealing destroy big business
"I cant do it by myself, I need everyone of you to open your computers to Illegal material"
Nothing to see here carry on
I light of your good humor, Phil Katz, who wrote PKZip died showing very little profit from his wildly popular program.
