Should Pastor Jones burn the Qu'ran?

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:29 am

It's great to be an American with all that freedom.

David · Post by **David** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:33 am

No, he should not.

Roody · Post by **Roody** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:38 am

Personally I think it sends the wrong message having him do it, but I support his right to do it.

Dan · Post by **Dan** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:03 pm

well,I say yes,because people are allowed to disgrace our American flag by burning it !

what's the real difference ?

Easto · Post by **Easto** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:07 pm

Although he may have some sort of right to... I think it is wrong on so many different levels I don't even know where to start.

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:07 pm

Dan wrote:well,I say yes,because people are allowed to disgrace our American flag by burning it !

what's the real difference ?

I think you are misunderstanding one small bit of info...we all agree that this is Constitutionally protected free speech. The question is not "is it allowed/legal?" but rather..."should he do it?"

Should he exercise his right?

Dan · Post by **Dan** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:08 pm

JawZ wrote:I think you are misunderstanding one small bit of info...we all agree that this is Constitutionally protected free speech. The question is not "is it allowed/legal?" but rather..."should he do it?"

Should he exercise his right?

again I say yes,for reasons already stated

you could ask the same of the people that burn our flag

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:10 pm

Dan wrote:again I say yes,for reasons already stated

and that's perfectly fine.

I didn't want to mislead anyone with how I posed the poll question.

Rivas · Post by **Rivas** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:10 pm

Dan wrote:well,I say yes,because people are allowed to disgrace our American flag by burning it !

what's the real difference ?

our soldiers in afghanistan ?
1 billion pissed off muslims ?

Isn't it different ?

Dan · Post by **Dan** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:13 pm

Rivas wrote:our soldiers in afghanistan ?
1 billion pissed off muslims ?

Isn't it different ?

no it's not,

more Americans should get pissed off about people that burn our flag !

people are so busy protecting the "rights" of everyone else,I think OUR(americans) rights take a back seat .

so we are supposed to "tread lightly" so as to not upset these people ?

how much more can they hate us ?

would this story create the same controversy if he wanted to burn a bible ?

Sava700 · Post by **Sava700** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:14 pm

loop2kil · Post by **loop2kil** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:16 pm

I think it's a bad idea...this act of proving whatever point he is trying to accomplish will open up a can of worms that will not be good for anyone.

Brk · Post by **Brk** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:32 pm

It's idiotic, but if he wants to, let him.

The real problem to me is the way Petraeus and others are framing this as something that "puts troops in harm's way". Once that precedence is set, all kinds of speech are likely to fall under that blanket.

David · Post by **David** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:34 pm

Dan wrote:again I say yes,for reasons already stated

you could ask the same of the people that burn our flag

Should people burn the American flag?

We can, but we shouldn't

Rivas · Post by **Rivas** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:37 pm

Dan wrote:no it's not,

more Americans should get pissed off about people that burn our flag !

people are so busy protecting the "rights" of everyone else,I think OUR(americans) rights take a back seat .

so we are supposed to "tread lightly" so as to not upset these people ?
how much more can they hate us ?

It will just unite them. It's not going to be bad guys vs good guys fight, it will be muslims vs christians. Don't get me wrong look at crusades, wait, all he needs is blessing from pope

The difference is, muslims are living all around the world, why do they burn your flag and not a flag of all christian countries ?

How you are going to supply our soldiers when Pakistan Turkey just to name a few will close their door ?

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:38 pm

Burke wrote:It's idiotic, but if he wants to, let him.

The real problem to me is the way Petraeus and others are framing this as something that "puts troops in harm's way". Once that precedence is set, all kinds of speech are likely to fall under that blanket.

I just got done making some posts about this on Ars...

I will quote myself lol

&quot wrote:

At no time are we (in the military) out of danger. As a volunteer in the US, I am obligated by oath to defend idiots like Jones in their expression of Constitutionally protected free speech. It's the entire point of our existence. Our oath is to preserve the essence of our Constitution and all that it stands for. So when General Petraeus says that more lives will be in danger if the Qu'ran is burned...I say total ****ing ********! Our lives are obligated to that very right!!!!!!!!!!! IF we are to die for a reason...I'd much rather die in defense of a real freedom than some lame ****ing excuse like Iraqi freedom. And if this puts our lives in greater danger, then so be it...it's why we exist...to stand as a buffer between enemies of our freedom and the American civilian public.

Prey521 · Post by **Prey521** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:43 pm

Burke wrote:It's idiotic, but if he wants to, let him.

The real problem to me is the way Petraeus and others are framing this as something that "puts troops in harm's way". Once that precedence is set, all kinds of speech are likely to fall under that blanket.

Agreed, it's silly to make such a statement because they make it sound as if the troops would be in any less danger without the burning of the Quran.

And no, he shouldn't burn it.

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:45 pm

Rivas wrote:It will just unite them. It's not going to be bad guys vs good guys fight, it will be muslims vs christians. Don't get me wrong look at crusades, wait, all he needs is blessing from pope

The difference is, muslims are living all around the world, why do they burn your flag and not a flag of all christian countries ?

How you are going to supply our soldiers when Pakistan Turkey just to name a few will close their door ?

Symbolically, it could potentially be used as galvanizing force for recruitment but in the end, it's just setting fire to some paper. People need to learn to better control their outrage and if people want to get violent, they may wind up dead. Besides, burning books hasn't helped any of the book burners of the past.

TonyT · Post by **TonyT** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 1:14 pm

No.

Whether he has the right to do it is of no significance.
It's not just some paper, it's a symbol in the context of burning it.

Should the southern religious right have burned Beatles records in 1963-64? It was their right. That effort sure did stop rock 'n roll, didn't it?

Burning bras was effective too. Had they not done that we wouldn't have the VS push-up bra.

Burning a book is still an effort to combat something with force. Force as a solution never accompolished anything in this world. Some force, along with reason is what solves problems.

Although Jones' church membership might climb up to about 54 if he does burn it.

Paft · Post by **Paft** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 3:04 pm

Burke wrote:The real problem to me is the way Petraeus and others are framing this as something that "puts troops in harm's way". Once that precedence is set, all kinds of speech are likely to fall under that blanket.

...And troops are ever completely out of harm's way? I certainly don't remember anything in my enlistment about personal safety or security, but I sure do remember a lot of emphasis on defending this country and the people in it! And that includes, as distasteful and hateful as this is, this idiot "pastor's" right to burn copies of the Qu'ran.

PsykoPenguin · Post by **PsykoPenguin** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 3:26 pm

Burn all non penguinistic texts!

Post by **YeOldeStonecat** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 5:35 pm

A quick read, worth a minute or two of your time
http://www.slate.com/id/2266535/

akbarri · Post by **akbarri** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 5:36 pm

NO,

It will be a third world war / WW3
keep the PEACEFULNESS in this world

RoundEye · Post by **RoundEye** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 7:55 pm

Does he have the right to do it? Yes, but I think that right is the topic for another thread. Should he do it? Hell no. It has the potential for turning people who like Americans or those that are on the fence about liking Americans into American haters.

It’s going to turn this into a religious war, Christian vs. Muslim, that we’ll never be able to find any comprise. It’s a very, very bad idea, especially coming from a man of the cloth such as this. He’s not thinking of the world view, only his personal perverted satisfaction.

I’d like to sit there with a fire extinguisher. Everytime he lit the Koran, give it a blast and put it out. That should get his and everybody that agrees with him panties in a wad, and maybe let some of the Muslims know that all Americans do not agree with him. Bottom line is…
…burning the Koran should not be done.

Leatherneck · Post by **Leatherneck** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:07 pm

I think it's completely unnecessary. On the other hand can someone who already wishes us dead be any more hateful? Christians are killed all the time for proselytizing and people killed for mere possession of a bible. We are better than this.

In this case I say WWJD? I have a feeling that he'd rather find a nice olive branch to make a warming fire.

Miggs · Post by **Miggs** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:11 pm

I'll bring these.

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Prey521 · Post by **Prey521** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:13 pm

Shinobi · Post by **Shinobi** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:31 pm

I do not think burning a book such as the Koran / Qur'an should happen, just as I would not want to see a bible being burned.

I do have a question..

Just because one man.. (or 50 people) may burn the Koran / Qur'an what gives the right for "all Muslims" to target Americans? That's what I keep seeing, live interviews in other countries saying that all Muslims will target Americans.

We have all talked about the Mosque that is being built near ground zero.. and how we should not target Muslims by saying they can not build it. Targeting Muslims is wrong just because of the ways of the radical Muslims out there and the terrorism that they practice.

Is that what they call a "double standard"?

TonyT · Post by **TonyT** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 9:38 pm

Just because one man.. (or 50 people) may burn the Koran / Qur'an what gives the right for "all Muslims" to target Americans? That's what I keep seeing, live interviews in other countries saying that all Muslims will target Americans.

It doesn't and what you are seeing is the propaganda media spewing what they have been instructed to say by vested interest groups (cia, banks, etc). The media usually always speaks in broad generalities such as "they say" and "everybody knows" and "all muslims". When it comes to news such as this they never quote exact individual sources because it's invented news, hype to sell copy.

This whole "mosque in NY" and related bs was trumped up news, inflated by the media. Usually when there's news like this it's a smokescreen to divert our attention away from real issues.

Makes one wonder, what new policies are they trying to sneak past the American public?

Shinobi · Post by **Shinobi** » Wed Sep 08, 2010 10:15 pm

I think the quote that Jonathan Swift said, back in the early to mid 1700's said it best..

We have just enough religion to make us hate, but not enough to make us love one another.

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Jonathan_Swift

blebs · Post by **blebs** » Thu Sep 09, 2010 7:23 am

Just because they have a right to burn it, does mean it's right to do. I haven't yet read all of the Quran, but from what I have read, they will forever be fighting to take over the world. To burn their religious symbolic book will only incite the more radical form of Muslims into taking even further steps against all Americans.

No, it should not be burned, even though they've desecrated our flag, bibles, teachings etc. We are better then that, at least I'd hope so.

JC · Post by JC » Thu Sep 09, 2010 7:45 pm

I believe the radical muslims are gonna what they do, this gives them an excuse. I mean what prompted them to bomb the Cole, and the first WTC bombing? Our troops are in harms way wether some idiot burns the ko-ran or not.

Roody · Post by **Roody** » Thu Sep 09, 2010 7:49 pm

Radical muslims don't need this for an excuse though JC. They have plenty of things they can point to as an excuse like our presence in their holy land to name one. That said I agree with you 100% that our troops are in harm's way regardless of what happens here. That's why I am a little annoyed at Petraeus, Obama, Clinton etc.. when they act as if burning the Qu'ran will make things any worse then they already are.

Sava700 · Post by **Sava700** » Thu Sep 09, 2010 8:35 pm

A Florida minister who had created an international furor with his plan to burn the Quran on the ninth anniversary of the 9/11 attacks canceled the event under intense pressure Thursday, saying he agreed to back off after reaching a deal to move the location of a controversial mosque near New York's ground zero.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/09/ ... bsCarousel

Prey521 · Post by **Prey521** » Thu Sep 09, 2010 8:43 pm

Sava700 wrote:http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/09/ ... bsCarousel

Heard it earlier on the radio. That minister must be high because they're claiming that they've never spoken to him and that the mosque will not be relocated.

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Thu Sep 09, 2010 9:05 pm

Trump has offered to buy the property for more than its worth.

Sava700 · Post by **Sava700** » Thu Sep 09, 2010 9:12 pm

A Florida pastor who called off a Quran burning said late Thursday he was "rethinking our position" after a proposed meeting over the location of an Islamic center near New York's ground zero went unconfirmed.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/09/09/florid ... tml?hpt=T1

Sava700 · Post by **Sava700** » Thu Sep 09, 2010 9:27 pm