HELP! Pings times too high.

[Love2lounge2]

I'm using the Sprint EVDO network for access and have the Pantech PX500 Rev A card but Rev A hasn’t been turned on in Buena Park (Los Angeles) CA but my upload and download times have been acceptable with signal strength between -71dBm to -83dBm but I think I can do better if my latency (ping) times were lower. I have downloaded and ran TCP Optimizer 2.0.3 which helped my speeds but latency times have always been consistently high and I'm looking for suggestions to lower those times. I'm using a 2005 Toshiba-XP(SP2)-1gb RAM and no spyware or viruses.

Here are my numbers:



Browser/OS = Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.0.7) Gecko/20060909 Firefox/1.5.0.7
Notes: Read the Analyzer FAQ if the above is not your IP address.
TCP options string = 020405b40103030201010402
MTU = 1500
MTU is fully optimized for broadband.
MSS = 1460
Maximum useful data in each packet = 1460, which equals MSS.
Default TCP Receive Window (RWIN) = 256960
RWIN Scaling (RFC1323) = 2 bits (scale factor of 4)
Unscaled TCP Receive Window = 64240

RWIN is a multiple of MSS
Other RWIN values that might work well with your current MTU/MSS:
513920 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 8)
256960 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 4) <-- current value
128480 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 2)
64240 (MSS x 44)
bandwidth * delay product (Note this is not a speed test):

Your TCP Window limits you to: 10278.4 kbps (1284.8 KBytes/s) @ 200ms
Your TCP Window limits you to: 4111.36 kbps (513.92 KBytes/s) @ 500ms
MTU Discovery (RFC1191) = ON
Time to live left = 48 hops
TTL value is ok.
Timestamps (RFC1323) = OFF
Selective Acknowledgements (RFC2018) = ON
IP type of service field (RFC1349) = 00000000 (0)

Pinging [193.10.252.19] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=311ms TTL=231
Pinging [193.10.252.19] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=327ms TTL=231
Pinging [193.10.252.19] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=288ms TTL=231
Pinging [193.10.252.19] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=302ms TTL=231
Pinging [193.10.252.19] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=321ms TTL=231
Pinging [218.32.192.112] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=280ms TTL=45
Pinging [218.32.192.112] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=254ms TTL=45
Pinging [218.32.192.112] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=272ms TTL=45
Pinging [218.32.192.112] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=266ms TTL=45
Pinging [218.32.192.112] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=294ms TTL=45
Pinging [204.127.166.135] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=200ms TTL=40
Pinging [204.127.166.135] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=183ms TTL=40
Pinging [204.127.166.135] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=156ms TTL=40
Pinging [204.127.135.135] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=201ms TTL=43
Pinging [204.127.135.135] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=184ms TTL=43
Pinging [207.155.248.99] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=119ms TTL=238
Pinging [207.155.248.99] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=141ms TTL=238
Pinging [207.155.248.99] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=148ms TTL=238
Pinging [207.155.248.99] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=144ms TTL=238
Pinging [207.155.248.99] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=126ms TTL=238
Pinging [63.217.30.70] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=200ms TTL=45
Pinging [63.217.30.70] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=221ms TTL=45
Pinging [63.217.30.70] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=195ms TTL=45
Pinging [63.217.30.70] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=199ms TTL=45
Pinging [63.217.30.70] with 32 bytes ->bytes=32 time=201ms TTL=45
Ping statistics for above hosts:
Packets: Sent = 25, Received = 25, Lost = 0 (0% loss)
Approximate round trip times (RTT) in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 119ms, Maximum = 327ms, Average = 221ms
Thanks ahead of time for your help.

[trogers]

Use the following with TCP Optimizer:

General Settings tab:
Custom settings - check
Modify All Network Adapters - check
network adapter selection - your NIC
MTU - 1500
TTL - 64
TCP Receive Window - 32120
MTU Discovery - Yes
Black Hole Detect - No
Selective Acks - Yes
Max Duplicate ACKs - 2
TCP 1323 Options:
Windows Scaling - uncheck
Timestamps - uncheck
Advanced Settings tab:
Max Connections per Server - 10
Max Connections per 1.0 Server - 20
LocalPriority - 5
Host Priority - 6
DNSPriority - 7
NetbtPriority - 8
Lan Browsing speedup - optimized
QoS: NonBestEffortLimit - 0
ToS: DisableUserTOSSetting - 0
ToS: DefaultTOSValue - 80
MaxNegativeCacheTtl - 0
NetFailureCacheTime - 0
NegativeSOACache Time - 0
LAN Request Buffer Size - 32768

[Love2lounge2]

Use the following with TCP Optimizer:

General Settings tab:
Custom settings - check
Modify All Network Adapters - check
network adapter selection - your NIC
MTU - 1500
TTL - 64
TCP Receive Window - 32120
MTU Discovery - Yes
Black Hole Detect - No
Selective Acks - Yes
Max Duplicate ACKs - 2
TCP 1323 Options:
Windows Scaling - uncheck
Timestamps - uncheck
Advanced Settings tab:
Max Connections per Server - 10
Max Connections per 1.0 Server - 20
LocalPriority - 5
Host Priority - 6
DNSPriority - 7
NetbtPriority - 8
Lan Browsing speedup - optimized
QoS: NonBestEffortLimit - 0
ToS: DisableUserTOSSetting - 0
ToS: DefaultTOSValue - 80
MaxNegativeCacheTtl - 0
NetFailureCacheTime - 0
NegativeSOACache Time - 0
LAN Request Buffer Size - 32768

Trogers, thanks for your help, this is my number
before your suggested settings:


After your suggested settings:


Browser/OS = Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.0.7) Gecko/20060909 Firefox/1.5.0.7
Notes: Read the Analyzer FAQ if the above is not your IP address.
TCP options string = 020405b40103030201010402
MTU = 1500
MTU is fully optimized for broadband.
MSS = 1460
Maximum useful data in each packet = 1460, which equals MSS.
Default TCP Receive Window (RWIN) = 256960
RWIN Scaling (RFC1323) = 2 bits (scale factor of 4)
Unscaled TCP Receive Window = 64240

RWIN is a multiple of MSS
Other RWIN values that might work well with your current MTU/MSS:
513920 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 8)
256960 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 4) <-- current value
128480 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 2)
64240 (MSS x 44)
bandwidth * delay product (Note this is not a speed test):

Your TCP Window limits you to: 10278.4 kbps (1284.8 KBytes/s) @ 200ms
Your TCP Window limits you to: 4111.36 kbps (513.92 KBytes/s) @ 500ms
MTU Discovery (RFC1191) = ON
Time to live left = 48 hops
TTL value is ok.
Timestamps (RFC1323) = OFF
Selective Acknowledgements (RFC2018) = ON
IP type of service field (RFC1349) = 00000000 (0)

I notice the TCP Analyzer is indicating 256960 for receive window after I had change it to your suggested 32120.

I'm open to trying new settings.

[trogers]

RWIN at 256960 is too high for your connection of max 1.5 mbps. The suitable RWIN should be 32120 if you are in the US and 64240 if you are overseas.

So it seems your RWIN is stuck at 256960. Try using the TCP Optimizer and reset your registry to Windows default and check if changes have been made with TCP Analyzer.

[Love2lounge2]

RWIN at 256960 is too high for your connection of max 1.5 mbps. The suitable RWIN should be 32120 if you are in the US and 64240 if you are overseas.

So it seems your RWIN is stuck at 256960. Try using the TCP Optimizer and reset your registry to Windows default and check if changes have been made with TCP Analyzer.

Still stuck @ 256960 after restoring to Window default settings.

What else can I do?

Browser/OS = Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.0.7) Gecko/20060909 Firefox/1.5.0.7
Notes: Read the Analyzer FAQ if the above is not your IP address.
TCP options string = 020405b40103030201010402
MTU = 1500
MTU is fully optimized for broadband.
MSS = 1460
Maximum useful data in each packet = 1460, which equals MSS.
Default TCP Receive Window (RWIN) = 256960
RWIN Scaling (RFC1323) = 2 bits (scale factor of 4)
Unscaled TCP Receive Window = 64240

RWIN is a multiple of MSS
Other RWIN values that might work well with your current MTU/MSS:
513920 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 8)
256960 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 4) <-- current value
128480 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 2)
64240 (MSS x 44)
bandwidth * delay product (Note this is not a speed test):

Your TCP Window limits you to: 10278.4 kbps (1284.8 KBytes/s) @ 200ms
Your TCP Window limits you to: 4111.36 kbps (513.92 KBytes/s) @ 500ms
MTU Discovery (RFC1191) = ON
Time to live left = 48 hops
TTL value is ok.
Timestamps (RFC1323) = OFF
Selective Acknowledgements (RFC2018) = ON
IP type of service field (RFC1349) = 00000000 (0)

[trogers]

Have you ever used Cablenut to tweak?

[Love2lounge2]

Have you ever used Cablenut to tweak?

Is it as easy to use as the TCP Optimizer and does it have a default restore option?

[trogers]

No. I am not suggesting that you use Cablenut. It is just that Cablenut tweaks an AFD parameter that in XP SP2 overrides TCP parameter.

If you have not used it then do the following with TCP Optimizer:

General Settings tab:
Custom settings - check
Modify All Network Adapters - check
network adapter selection - your NIC
MTU - 1500
TTL - 64
TCP Receive Window - leave blank
MTU Discovery - Yes
Black Hole Detect - No
Selective Acks - Yes
Max Duplicate ACKs - 2
TCP 1323 Options:
Windows Scaling - uncheck
Timestamps - uncheck
Advanced Settings tab:
Max Connections per Server - 10
Max Connections per 1.0 Server - 20
LocalPriority - 5
Host Priority - 6
DNSPriority - 7
NetbtPriority - 8
Lan Browsing speedup - optimized
QoS: NonBestEffortLimit - 0
ToS: DisableUserTOSSetting - 0
ToS: DefaultTOSValue - 80
MaxNegativeCacheTtl - 0
NetFailureCacheTime - 0
NegativeSOACache Time - 0
LAN Request Buffer Size - 32768
Then select "Apply Changes" and reboot to take effect

[Love2lounge2]

[quote="trogers"]No. I am not suggesting that you use Cablenut. It is just that Cablenut tweaks an AFD parameter that in XP SP2 overrides TCP parameter.

If you have not used it then do the following with TCP Optimizer:

General Settings tab:
Custom settings - check
Modify All Network Adapters - check
network adapter selection - your NIC
MTU - 1500
TTL - 64
TCP Receive Window - leave blank
MTU Discovery - Yes
Black Hole Detect - No
Selective Acks - Yes
Max Duplicate ACKs - 2
TCP 1323 Options:
Windows Scaling - uncheck
Timestamps - uncheck
Advanced Settings tab:
Max Connections per Server - 10
Max Connections per 1.0 Server - 20
LocalPriority - 5
Host Priority - 6
DNSPriority - 7
NetbtPriority - 8
Lan Browsing speedup - optimized
QoS: NonBestEffortLimit - 0
ToS: DisableUserTOSSetting - 0
ToS: DefaultTOSValue - 80
MaxNegativeCacheTtl - 0
NetFailureCacheTime - 0
NegativeSOACache Time - 0
LAN Request Buffer Size - 32768
Then select "Apply Changes" and reboot to take effect[/QUOTE

Will these settings work using a Sprint EVDO wireless internet card?

[trogers]

Will these settings work using a Sprint EVDO wireless internet card?

Yes. These settings are only to try free your RWIN setting. They are not for optimization.

[Love2lounge2]

Yes. These settings are only to try free your RWIN setting. They are not for optimization.

OK my RWIN setting is now freed up, here is my latest report:

Browser/OS = Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.0.7) Gecko/20060909 Firefox/1.5.0.7
Notes: Read the Analyzer FAQ if the above is not your IP address.
TCP options string = 020405b40103030101010402
MTU = 1500
MTU is fully optimized for broadband.
MSS = 1460
Maximum useful data in each packet = 1460, which equals MSS.
Default TCP Receive Window (RWIN) = 65700
RWIN Scaling (RFC1323) = 1 bits (scale factor of 2)
Unscaled TCP Receive Window = 32850

RWIN is not fully optimized (even though it is a comparatively large number). The unscaled RWIN value is lower than it should be. Also, RWIN being close to and above 65535 does not justify the header overhead of enabling TCP 1323 Options. You might want to use one of the recommended RWIN values below.

RWIN is a multiple of MSS
Other RWIN values that might work well with your current MTU/MSS:
513920 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 8)
256960 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 4)
128480 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 2)
64240 (MSS x 44)
bandwidth * delay product (Note this is not a speed test):

Your TCP Window limits you to: 2628 kbps (328.5 KBytes/s) @ 200ms
Your TCP Window limits you to: 1051.2 kbps (131.4 KBytes/s) @ 500ms
MTU Discovery (RFC1191) = ON
Time to live left = 49 hops
TTL value is ok.
Timestamps (RFC1323) = OFF
Selective Acknowledgements (RFC2018) = ON
IP type of service field (RFC1349) = 00000000 (0)

[trogers]

Do the following with TCP Optimizer to set your RWIN to 32120:

General Settings tab:
Custom settings - check
Modify All Network Adapters - check
network adapter selection - your NIC
MTU - 1500
TTL - 64
TCP Receive Window - 32120
MTU Discovery - Yes
Black Hole Detect - No
Selective Acks - Yes
Max Duplicate ACKs - 2
TCP 1323 Options:
Windows Scaling - uncheck
Timestamps - uncheck
Advanced Settings tab:
Max Connections per Server - 10
Max Connections per 1.0 Server - 20
LocalPriority - 5
Host Priority - 6
DNSPriority - 7
NetbtPriority - 8
Lan Browsing speedup - optimized
QoS: NonBestEffortLimit - 0
ToS: DisableUserTOSSetting - 0
ToS: DefaultTOSValue - 80
MaxNegativeCacheTtl - 0
NetFailureCacheTime - 0
NegativeSOACache Time - 0
LAN Request Buffer Size - 32768
Then select "Apply Changes" and reboot to take effect

[sbiz]

Modify All Network Adapters - check
Max Connections per 1.0 Server - 20

Thanks for your thoughts on this. I had questions on the above two settings you suggested for EVDO data cards.
1) Most of us with data cards use several connection methods: free local Wifi that might be faster, paid WiFi when out of EVDO range, office DSL, etc. In such cases do we really want to check "Modify All Network Adapters"?
2) Why did you suggest using twice as many concurrent connections for a HTTP 1.0 server as for 1.1 server?

As a general observation, TCP Optimizer appears to err on on the side of high bandwidth. The EVDO carriers in the US state that we should expect average download speeds of 400-700 kbps with an absolute maximum of 2400 kbps if you are the only one using the signal antenna and all the network hardware is optimal. TCP Optimizer suggests trying multiples of 32120 and adjusting settings for RWINs higher than 64240 right off the bat.

[trogers]

Thanks for your thoughts on this. I had questions on the above two settings you suggested for EVDO data cards.
1) Most of us with data cards use several connection methods: free local Wifi that might be faster, paid WiFi when out of EVDO range, office DSL, etc. In such cases do we really want to check "Modify All Network Adapters"?
2) Why did you suggest using twice as many concurrent connections for a HTTP 1.0 server as for 1.1 server?

As a general observation, TCP Optimizer appears to err on on the side of high bandwidth. The EVDO carriers in the US state that we should expect average download speeds of 400-700 kbps with an absolute maximum of 2400 kbps if you are the only one using the signal antenna and all the network hardware is optimal. TCP Optimizer suggests trying multiples of 32120 and adjusting settings for RWINs higher than 64240 right off the bat.

Answer to your question 1 is yes. TCP Window (RWIN) is not a field in your Nic, but some other minor fields like QoS may be.

The settings for max. connections of HTTP 1.0 server and HTTP 1.1 server are derived from trials. They are tweaks for the IE browser only and 10 and 20 have been found to work best for most comps. Those using Win98 may have to tune down the values to 8/8 or 8/10.

TCP Window size is always tweaked on the basis of bandwidth x latency and not bandwidth only. We maximizes the TCP Window to the highest even multiple of MSS without Window scaling and any need to have RWIN set higher than 65535 will be scaled from this base value.

If your bandwidth requires a smaller RWIN from this base value, it can be used without loss of performance provided it is set as an even multiple of MSS.

If your Nic becomes a bottleneck for your bandwidth (eg. max 2400 kbps on a 10 mbps line) then either you replace it with a higher capacity Nic or you retune RWIN to suit your max. reduced bandwidth x latency.

[legumo]

don't waste your time trying to fix your Pings, there's nothing you can do to LOWER it, you can make things a tiny bit smoother/faster but they won't go lower.

this is an ISP problem and all you can do is contact them and let them know.

regardless of RWIN settings or not, if your ISP is congested you gonna get high pings and absolutely no tweak will fix that.

so go ahead and call your ISP cause it's all you can do. period.

sorry for being straight ahead with you but it's the truth.

the only other possible reason to fix pings (IF POSSIBLE), if you got a WIRELESS modem/router then move it away perhaps to another room and try, if it fix the pings then it was interference, if not then time to contact the ISP.

[mccoffee]

don't waste your time trying to fix your Pings, there's nothing you can do to LOWER it, you can make things a tiny bit smoother/faster but they won't go lower.

this is an ISP problem and all you can do is contact them and let them know.

regardless of RWIN settings or not, if your ISP is congested you gonna get high pings and absolutely no tweak will fix that.

so go ahead and call your ISP cause it's all you can do. period.

sorry for being straight ahead with you but it's the truth.

the only other possible reason to fix pings (IF POSSIBLE), if you got a WIRELESS modem/router then move it away perhaps to another room and try, if it fix the pings then it was interference, if not then time to contact the ISP.

totally agree with that i would also tried a wired connnection instead of wireless if your router has that capabliity