well, Terrorism works!!!

The_Lurker · Post by **The_Lurker** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 1:13 am

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040315/D81AHBR80.html

"Spain's Socialists scored a dramatic upset in elections Sunday, unseating conservatives stung by charges they provoked the Madrid terror bombings by supporting the U.S......."

give it time, this world's going to hell in a handbasket!

(it's a saying people)

brembo · Post by **brembo** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 1:20 am

Eeek...subsuming to the force of terrorist attacks. Bad precident, wonder what the terrorist organizations will demand next? Don't think I'll be visiting Spain anytime soon.

downhill · Post by **downhill** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 1:25 am

Goodness, the Lurker.....I know I could be wrong, but I'd not say that the reason Spain once again put Socialism in power is because they see President Bush as a terrorist. I'm suprised you posted this.

The_Lurker · Post by **The_Lurker** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 1:33 am

Originally posted by downhill
Goodness, the Lurker.....I know I could be wrong, but I'd not say that the reason Spain once again put Socialism in power is because they see President Bush as a terrorist. I'm suprised you posted this.

"It was the first time a government that backed the Iraq war has been voted out of office"

"raised the disturbing prospect that terrorists aligned with Osama bin Laden had changed the course of a national election."

also on the evening news here, they were making note of the fact that the incumbent party was clearly in the lead, leading up to the bombings.

no suprise from me, just bad precedence from them!

vinnie · Post by **vinnie** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 2:03 am

Guiseppe Gariboldi.

Mao Zedong.

Che Guevera.

Stalin.

Of course terrorism works. Just we stop calling it terrorism and instead call it revolutionary, or proletarian equality, or workers uprising or whatever else people feel like. Socialism in particular tends to work quite well in conjunction with terrorism, they go hand in hand almost.

jayyy · Post by **jayyy** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 2:04 am

Originally posted by The_Lurker
no suprise from me, just bad precedence from them!

Bad precedence for Bush

SeedOfChaos · Post by **SeedOfChaos** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 4:07 am

While I'm not sad to see Aznar go per se, I hate the very likely reason why he was eventually voted out of office. I actually thought the bombings would've had the contrary effect, I don't get it. And yes, it is bad that terrorism changed the outcome of the election.

Thcranky1 · Post by **Thcranky1** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 5:17 am

the news that I watch...

minutes after the bombing had taken place simply postulated the idea that the bombing could have been an attempt to cause an effect in the voting. The socialist party had not been out of office for too many years in the first place. If I'm not mistaken it was less then 10 years ago that the populists gained the office. I am wondering if the bombing had any effect whatsoever on the vote and the socialist party won simply from the people's vote. (meaning that possibly the bombing had no effect but is simply making headlines) Couldn't it be quite possible that from this postulation it has grown into a now considered way of thinking and then so on and so forth?

I tend to wonder how any country can honestly function from day to day if their people's true way of thinking can be altered and swayed so easily. I mean I never even considered changing my political views, moral values and learned behaviors when the events of Sept. 11th were taking place or shoot I never have even thought of party preference whatsoever.

Now I do not know about Spain's history much farther back then a decade or so but I would not be too terriblly surprised if the people there are not being mislead and information is supressed by BOTH political parties.

Either way it turns out there I know that it was America's duty to remove a brutal dictator and I am glad and I know that the Iraqi people are better off with Saddam gone. I know there is lots of things that need to be done before the country is back on its feet but the fact that the Democrats are thrusting so much rhetoric towards the Bush Administration during a time of war is not helping things whatsoever. Everyone needs to remember that Bush did not use Executive Orders to go to Iraq but went to the United Nations as well as our Congress and gained approval. How can Kerry turn and say anything negative after his vote of go to Iraq. How can anyone?

Please think about this as well...France and Germany and Russia simply wanted to wait 30 more days...we all know that there was not going to be any change in 30 days. 19 failed attempts with Res. 1441 and nothing...Inspector's were thrown out in 1998...you have to admit that Saddam had plenty of time and was not going to change.

PEACE!!!

Thcranky1

Ghosthunter · Post by **Ghosthunter** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 5:45 am

that is exactly why i fear a major attack will happen on US soil close to our elections.

They are hoping for the same effect, and if they did not decide that then i bet they decided it now.

jayyy · Post by **jayyy** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 8:15 am

Originally posted by SeedOfChaos
While I'm not sad to see Aznar go per se, I hate the very likely reason why he was eventually voted out of office. I actually thought the bombings would've had the contrary effect, I don't get it. And yes, it is bad that terrorism changed the outcome of the election.

Spain was opposed to the war from the beginning. Most people were upset the government went in in the first place.
Another thing is that a lot of people believe that the government "covered up" teh attack and tried to attribute it to ETA when they knew it was Al Qaeda, because taht would make them look bad. That would be bad if it were true, but I have my doubts about that, thats pretty far-fetched.

But at any rate its scary that they might have gotten what they wanted. Just imagine how much worse it could be now they think they can get results.

Roody · Post by **Roody** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 8:19 am

If pretty much all the news stations are telling the truth then it would appear the bombings certainly didnt help the outgoing leadership.

Thcranky1 · Post by **Thcranky1** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 8:40 am

If either of those terrorist groups were to get what they wanted then there would not be any government party in office right now. To hell with them both I think both terror organizations should go to hell. Why would a government attempt to cover up terrorist activities from the true source? The war is against terrorism not a particular terrorist organization. The government would never try to make a bombing the actions of someone else. People need to start realizing that government conspiracies are today next to impossible with a world of technology. The media is everywhere and additionally for someone to say that Fox News and CNN and MSNBC and the others are 'in on it' is simply being a goof. This Capatalistic country that we live in negates any thought of that happening.
If one news source was to propose a particular event wrong or with deceit it would undoubtedly be reported on by the competition. The competition would report exclusively on the fact that another media source was putting out false propoganda. So one of the best things to happen for the world and the United States is the fact that Fox News came on the scene so that CNN and all the other democratic left wing governed media sources had to start being more equal...or as it is now coined..."Fair and Balanced!"

PEACE!!

--Thcranky1

Indy · Post by **Indy** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 9:07 am

Originally posted by jayyy
Just imagine how much worse it could be now they think they can get results.

That's the truely frightening aspect of the whole event...

SGTMAJRET · Post by **SGTMAJRET** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 12:47 pm

Yep, quite a solution. Stick your head in the sand and the bad terrorists will leave you alone.

MadDoctor · Post by **MadDoctor** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 12:59 pm

Originally posted by Ghosthunter
that is exactly why i fear a major attack will happen on US soil close to our elections.

IMO... The American people would overwhelmingly vote for Bush (a President that doesn’t have a problem using his military) if an attack happened on American soil just before the elections.

The bad guys know that Bush will use his military without hesitation. They don’t know what Kerry would do. However… they figure he’d be less likely to fire-up the B-52s for bombing runs than Bush.

An act of terrorism on U.S. soil before the elections insures Bush as President for another 4 years. I don’t think the terrorists want that.

Ghosthunter · Post by **Ghosthunter** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 1:07 pm

Originally posted by MadDoctor
IMO... The American people would overwhelmingly vote for Bush (a President that doesn’t have a problem using his military) if an attack happened on American soil just before the elections.

The bad guys know that Bush will use his military without hesitation. They don’t know what Kerry would do. However… they figure he’d be less likely to fire-up the B-52s for bombing runs than Bush.

An act of terrorism on U.S. soil before the elections insures Bush as President for another 4 years. I don’t think the terrorists want that.

I agree with you but afraid the general public might not.

Then again who knows what goes through the voter minds.

Then again it really is what the terrorists think, if they think they can do the same thing they did in Spain then who knows.

Either way i hope we dont have to find out.

MadDoctor · Post by **MadDoctor** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 1:09 pm

Originally posted by Ghosthunter
Iwho knows what goes through the voter minds.

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 1:40 pm

Ya know...maybe I need to leave Speedguide for good because you people are completely insane.

Is it me or did everyone go STUPID overnight?

Jesus H. Christ.......

MADRID, Spain (AP) - Spain's Socialists scored a dramatic upset in elections Sunday, unseating conservatives stung by charges they provoked the Madrid terror bombings by supporting the U.S.-led war in Iraq and making Spain a target for al-Qaida.

Hello....is anybody out there? Do you all not see what is written up above?

What the flying **** does Al-Qaeda have to do with Iraq? I thought all of our liberal friends had that figured out...Bush is wrong...there were no terror links to AL Qaeda.

So why in the hell make the connection now?

Oh...I know ****ing why....it's because it's now convenient to make the god damn case.

This is exactly the kind of RETARDED bull**** that just boils my ****ing veins....and you people refuse to see that you are being used by EVERYBODY to keep those in power and those who want power simply for powers sake. They are self serving, they don't give a damn about you...none of them.

I will be 35 in less than 6 months...and I retire from the military in less than 5 years.

Mark my words.....I will be President of the U.S. I have never had any doubts about it. I will be President and I will deliver the biggest kick to the worlds ass that you have ever seen.

Norm · Post by **Norm** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 1:48 pm

Originally posted by UOD
Ya know...maybe I need to leave Speedguide for good because you people are completely insane.

Is it me or did everyone go STUPID overnight?

Jesus H. Christ.......

Hello....is anybody out there? Do you all not see what is written up above?

What the flying **** does Al-Qaeda have to do with Iraq? I thought all of our liberal friends had that figured out...Bush is wrong...there were no terror links to AL Qaeda.

So why in the hell make the connection now?

Oh...I know ****ing why....it's because it's now convenient to make the god damn case.

This is exactly the kind of RETARDED bull**** that just boils my ****ing veins....and you people refuse to see that you are being used by EVERYBODY to keep those in power and those who want power simply for powers sake. They are self serving, they don't give a damn about you...none of them.

I will be 35 in less than 6 months...and I retire from the military in less than 5 years.

Mark my words.....I will be President of the U.S. I have never had any doubts about it. I will be President and I will deliver the biggest kick to the worlds ass that you have ever seen.

Go get em Evan

UOD for president !!!

Bouncer · Post by **Bouncer** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 5:39 pm

Oddly enough, Jayyy and I are in 100% agreement.

Spain has (whether it realizes it or not) just made itself an even bigger target. You think ETA (among others) didn't just learn what they could do via mass bombings? Spain just painted a big bullseye on itself.

For the socialists it'a short term win but a long term tar baby. If there's another successful attack in the next year they, not the conservatives, will get the blame. If there's an attack after they pull out of Iraq it will make them look even weaker. If ETA goes on a bombing spree (more likely now than ever) they will also look weaker, regardless of the timing.

I wonder how many Spainiards are going to die in the next few years because of this. I also wonder how well the extreme nationalists (anti-immigration) types will fare in the next round of elections if there's a bombing campaign by ETA or foreign nationals. That's a real worry for Spain, as anti-foreigner sentiment is starting t rise up. And that leads to things like Mosque/Synagogue burning.

:/

Spain must and should (obviously) do what they think is in their national interest. However, their new socialst PM is too busy making big speeches, and not busy enough paying attention to the pluses and minuses of staying in Iraq versus leaving. There is something to be said for standing up to terrorists, rather than be seen to be caving. He's always been against the war, but right now, in this time and place, after an attack like that ANYTHING besides resolute continuation of previous policy by the former government is seen as a TOTAL win for the anarchists. And that really does encourage them.

After this, why WOULDN'T ETA think they could bomb Spainish politicians into giving in to their demands for independence?

Think about that.

Regards,
-Bouncer-

Norm · Post by **Norm** » Mon Mar 15, 2004 6:15 pm

Apples and oranges

The Spaniards are all for fighting terror, always have been.
They are not against staying in Iraq either.

They don't support U.S. unilateralism or U.S. authority in Iraq.

They have stated many times they want to fight terror, all out war against terror actually.
They have also stated they will stay in Iraq under the U.N flag.

It's U.S. policy on the war in Iraq they are/were against, and U.S. authority in Iraq.

Bouncer · Post by **Bouncer** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 6:29 pm

You're missing the point though.

It's about perception. If I, a pro-choice terrorist, blows up a Cathloic Church and a new Pope throws out the Church's doctrine against abortion within two days, what do you think the perception is?

A) I, the Terrorist, was right and B) I got what I wanted.

What do you think my most likely course of action is when I want the Catholic Church to start performing gay marriages, given my track record?

It's about perception. Spain is a democracy and I have no problem with them excercising their rights under it. Spain's new gov't doesn't want them in Iraq and I have no problem with that either. Spains incoming PM, however, should wait till the bodies are buried before he announces he's going to do exactly what the terrorists want him to do.

It's about perception.

Regards,
-Bouncer-

Ghosthunter · Post by **Ghosthunter** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 6:46 pm

Originally posted by Bouncer
You're missing the point though.

It's about perception. If I, a pro-choice terrorist, blows up a Cathloic Church and a new Pope throws out the Church's doctrine against abortion within two days, what do you think the perception is?

A) I, the Terrorist, was right and B) I got what I wanted.

What do you think my most likely course of action is when I want the Catholic Church to start performing gay marriages, given my track record?

It's about perception. Spain is a democracy and I have no problem with them excercising their rights under it. Spain's new gov't doesn't want them in Iraq and I have no problem with that either. Spains incoming PM, however, should wait till the bodies are buried before he announces he's going to do exactly what the terrorists want him to do.

It's about perception.

Regards,
-Bouncer-

Totally agreed

and on that note the terrorists hate Bush right? If we get another attack a few days before election we dont know what will really happen but if the terrorists percieve it will help get rid of Bush then if there is anytime to attack us that would be the time.

That scares the hell out of me, because I am sure NY and Washigton would still be the targets.

MadDoctor · Post by **MadDoctor** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:05 pm

Originally posted by Ghosthunter
Then again who knows what goes through the terrorists mind.

brembo · Post by **brembo** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:11 pm

Originally posted by Ghosthunter
Then again who knows what goes through the terrorists mind.

One would hope a .223 round, fired by a Marine.

Joint Chiefs of Staff · Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:15 pm

Originally posted by Ghosthunter

and on that note the terrorists hate Bush right?

Terriorist might hate Bush but they hate what America stands for period regardless who is the president.

Ghosthunter · Post by **Ghosthunter** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:18 pm

Originally posted by Joint Chiefs of Staff
Terriorist might hate Bush but they hate what America stands for period regardless who is the president.

That true but wouldnt they rather have a preisdent who is weak on fighting terrorism?

MadDoctor · Post by **MadDoctor** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:20 pm

Originally posted by brembo
One would hope a .223 round, fired by a Marine.

*raises hand and jumps up and down*

Pick me! Pick me!

Joint Chiefs of Staff · Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:21 pm

Originally posted by Ghosthunter
That true but wouldnt they rather have a preisdent who is weak on fighting terrorism?

IMO after 9-11 no president will back down. The public is too hungry.

downhill · Post by **downhill** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:23 pm

If they want to be martyrs (and a lot of terriorsts strive for that) .....do you think they really care who the President is? The USA is the target....That's all of us.

Something else I've been wondering about, imho, I think the Socialist party in Spain was already heading for a win before the dispicable act. The bombing just added fuel to the fire.

brembo · Post by **brembo** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:33 pm

Originally posted by MadDoctor
*raises hand and jumps up and down*

Pick me! Pick me!

*gives Mad a gold star for effort*

(dirt)Nap time for Mr. terrorist.

SeedOfChaos · Post by **SeedOfChaos** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:49 pm

Originally posted by downhill
Something else I've been wondering about, imho, I think the Socialist party in Spain was already heading for a win before the dispicable act. The bombing just added fuel to the fire.

Nope, all polls before the bombing showed Aznar clearly in the lead. From what I heard, people were demonstrating all over the country on Saturday night before the election, accusing Aznar of lying, because he was insisting that it was the ETA, and that pretty much changed their mind.

MadDoctor · Post by **MadDoctor** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 7:53 pm

The new boy on the block.

jayyy · Post by **jayyy** » Wed Mar 17, 2004 11:08 pm

Originally posted by Norm
Apples and oranges

The Spaniards are all for fighting terror, always have been.
They are not against staying in Iraq either.

They don't support U.S. unilateralism or U.S. authority in Iraq.

They have stated many times they want to fight terror, all out war against terror actually.
They have also stated they will stay in Iraq under the U.N flag.

It's U.S. policy on the war in Iraq they are/were against, and U.S. authority in Iraq.

I think America would have a totally different reaction if something like this happened before an election. 9/11 shocked everyone, if it happened again people would react faster and get even more fighting mad.

SG Broadband Community

well, Terrorism works!!!

well, Terrorism works!!!

the news that I watch...

lol...