That damn router in Atlanta for Mediaone/at&t broadband

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Sun Sep 24, 2000 11:46 pm

I'm just sitting here wondering why I'm getting dialup download speeds from
a site that I usually get at least 30k/s from and wonder what in the world
is going on here and then I remember the past posts about that stupid
24.88.3.149 router and do a tracert to every site that I frequently visit
and to state the obvious the minute my connection hits that stupid router
pings sky rocket into and are consistently around 400ms throughout the
tracert. I can't believe we are being made to wait till the 27th earliest
and maybe later to fix this problem IT's JUST A DAMN ROUTER!!!!!!. Not only
do we have to put up with service not near cable modem standards everywhere
else in the country but DSL here sucks to. Isn't atlanta supposed to be a
fastly growing city and one of the centers of technology? then we do ppl in
the western boonies of Kansas getting better speed and performance then we
are. This is ridiculous
well just another bitching session from yours truely while my pleas and
those of many RR customers in atlanta I'm sure are being unheard. Why can't
we just have the service we pay for ATLEAST. well Im' outta here holler
back if you feel the same way

P.S. And for the haters with great service that say oh you're just bitching
cause your slow, Mind your own damn business this doesn't concern your dumb
ass so stop rubbing it in and giving me annoying lines like (it's still
better than 56k) I've been on greater lines then my cable and all that I'm
asking is the service that we pay for thats all.

BowEcho · Post by **BowEcho** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 12:06 am

I'm in Vermont on Adelphia 2-way and have the same type of problem to this router:

sl-bb10-nyc1.sprintlink.net 144.232.7.45

Most times between 10am and midnight, whenever I have to pass through this router on my way anywhere ( 5th or 6th hop out for me), my ping jumps to 400 or greater and of course every point after that has a high ping too. Been going on for a month or two now. What is the explanation for this? I'm getting really tired of it. Who do I complain to? My pings to the Adelphia part of the chain are all less than 50 ms, but as soon as I hit this hop, bam.

Mutilator · Post by **Mutilator** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 12:47 am

I'm with you Azazel.. Im in NC and I play my fair share of online games.... and it's getting to the point where I just feel like it's never going to get fixed heh. It's pretty damn bad when I ping 700+ with my cable modem yet if I dial up using my sister's AOL account (ACK!) I get a 250 ping! That's just not right

Kip Patterson · Post by **Kip Patterson** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 5:35 am

I sure understand your frustration, but it is not "just a damn router". Routers that introduce large delays do so because the downstream pipe is full. Getting more bandwidth is not a quick process. Yes, they should have planned ahead, but that isn't easy to do in this business.

The very success of Atlanta and your ISP is probably the root of the problem.

rhoyt · Post by **rhoyt** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 5:48 am

Azazel,

I also live in Atlanta and I have complained about the same router. I find it very difficult to understand the delay in replacing this componet. I spoke with one of the AT&T/Media One technicians who was well aware of the problem and appeared to be as frustrated as we are. His frustrations appear to result from not only having to hear angry customers complain but he seemed to be upset about the level of service that he was receiving as a AT&T/Media One customer because of the same router. He made one suggestion that I think we should all follow. Call AT&T/Media One and ask them to credit our accounts for the period that this router has been a problem.

I hope the repair estimates are correct. If they are we should be back to normal some time this week.

Rodney

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 8:05 am

Thanks for the reply's, I know that I'm not alone in my frustration. I've also been flaring up the newsgroups...get quite a lot of replies their. Alot of disgruntled customers like myself..hehe. Something that gets to me though is that mediaone in atlanta never announce when they are having a problem on their network status page.. I wonder who's the lazy bum getting paid to do this job. When the cable was out for 30 something hours in the offnet network status page it said network working properly when we couldn't get on. /me shakes his head
what a waste of webspace.

here's an example /me crosses his fingers b4 posting

http://www.mediaone.rr.com/rros2/ms/0,2023,26_66_2_ms_,00.html

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 8:06 am

hmm let me try this

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 8:07 am

/me shrugs... oh well i tried

aldamon · Post by **aldamon** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 9:18 am

God, I hope you guys are right about the fix date....That router has screwed my RR connection in Durham, NC for weeks!

iBringPain · Post by **iBringPain** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 10:40 am

I am having the same problems with the RR/Atl router. I called and they gave me 9 days credit...I was also told they have been instructed to tell everyone complaining the service will be fixed by the 27th but it is unlikely it will be fixed... according to the tech I spoke to. He said more than likely the problems will be resolved within 30 days.

I'm no expert but I think it is a combination of problems, maybe a router is really out but, I think RR/ATT is not allowing for all the bandwidth they need.

aldamon · Post by **aldamon** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 10:50 am

Originally posted by iBringPain:
I am having the same problems with the RR/Atl router. I called and they gave me 9 days credit...I was also told they have been instructed to tell everyone complaining the service will be fixed by the 27th but it is unlikely it will be fixed... according to the tech I spoke to. He said more than likely the problems will be resolved within 30 days.

Within 30 days of what? Does this mean it'll really be fixed by October 27th?

iBringPain · Post by **iBringPain** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 11:01 am

you are correct... Oct 27th

Mutilator · Post by **Mutilator** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 11:41 am

If it's not going to be fixed until October then I'm probably going to be saying bye bye to road runner... maybe I'll go back to bellsouth.net heh... without or without dsl I'd still get a very reliable connection that never once spiked on me like RR is doing now.
If people wouldn't oversell their bandwith we wouldn't have these damn problems to begin with...

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 1:05 pm

yeah with pings bad enough it makes a 56k look good I bet b4 this is over alot of ppl will leave at&t

Mutilator · Post by **Mutilator** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 1:10 pm

It's not affecting just AT&T.. it's affecting the entire Road Runner network.. atleast in the south east (I have Time Warner Cable + Road Runner)

Talking about making 56k look good... when I was on 56k I had 120 pings... now I get 20s-50s to some of my favorite servers... atleast when RR is working right.

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 1:13 pm

yeah I almost forgot the fact that at&t/timewarner are sharing the same router from North carolina down to florida...man that sucks

aldamon · Post by **aldamon** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 1:20 pm

I know that we all have been complaining here and in USENET and on the phone but have any of you lit a fire under AT&T / RR's asses by contacting the Attourney General? It seems like this September 27 / October 27 "deadline" is going to slip on a monthly basis until we can get them to commit to a date and then be held accountable for it...This situation is just ridiculous and I want someone to answer for it.

iBringPain · Post by **iBringPain** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 1:25 pm

I do not understand this one. I just ping my favorite CS server which is located in MO. My average ping use to be 125 now its is 90, also just DL a file from MS at 125 kb. What is the real problem here if anyone can share it with me I would apericate it.

aldamon · Post by **aldamon** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 1:30 pm

Off Peak?

Bouncer · Post by **Bouncer** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 1:37 pm

It is important to remember that all RR customers are being migrated to @home.

I mention it because it's very likely that things will get worse before they get better as the migration continues. You cannot fold one huge network into another huge network without problems.

This isn't an excuse for what's happening and I don't work for either company, as a RR customer I'm not particularly happy about the merger, for a couple of reasons, but that's me.

From a network standpoint it's much more likely to be an overloaded router, rather than insufficient bandwidth. There bandwidth didn't suddenly change, but the number of people being routed through that device in Atlanta did.

Regards,
-Bouncer-

------------------
"Yeah Baby, YEAH!!!"

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 1:50 pm

Bouncer the problem isn't during this time it usually happens right around 3pm on
pings sky rocket... downloads slow to a crawl it's almost painful to watch. Right now though everything is as ok as it'll ever get for RR. Also how do you know that we are being shifted to @home???

Kip Patterson · Post by **Kip Patterson** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 2:22 pm

What merger? This was discussed a year and a half ago, but didn't happen. At Home still a seperate, listed company.

Did I miss something?

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 2:27 pm

Kip At&t and mediaone RR have merged. At&t technically has a couple of months to get mediaone into their @home network and get them out of the RR network that timewarner has set up. The merger happend in late june I think. Hope that helps

Kip Patterson · Post by **Kip Patterson** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 2:36 pm

MediaOne I understand. The posting said all RR customers. I guess Bouncer thinks of RR as MediaOne, and I think of it as Time Warner. Oh, well. Hope it goes well for you, Bouncer. I'd not be too cool in your shoes. Although Time Warner doesn't understand what they're doing with cable modems as a business, they do get the job done technically for the most part.

What part of the country gets affected by this?

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 2:43 pm

right now the south east is whats being hit hard by this problem (georgia, florida, north and south carolina) all go thru the atlanta router.

aldamon · Post by **aldamon** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 3:00 pm

Originally posted by Azazel:
Kip At&t and mediaone RR have merged. At&t technically has a couple of months to get mediaone into their @home network and get them out of the RR network that timewarner has set up. The merger happend in late june I think. Hope that helps

So, does this mean that the TWC RR customers in NC won't have anything to do with router 24.88.3.149 once Mediaone becomes part of AT&T? God I hope so.......

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 3:11 pm

nope they will be completely out of the RR network and into the @home network

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 3:12 pm

oh another thing....keep in mind this transition will take a long!! time so don't expect a change anytime b4 christmas

rhoyt · Post by **rhoyt** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 3:26 pm

This situation appears to be getting to a point of who do you want to believe. I just talked with AT&T/Road Runner here in Atlanta. They advised me that the router problem should be repaired by the end of SEPTEMBER.

They, or atleast the person I spoke with, had no information concerning a switch from Road Runner to @home. Go figure!!!

Rodney

Kip Patterson · Post by **Kip Patterson** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 3:36 pm

The transition can't start until ATT has sold MediaOne's minority interest in Roadrunner. they have until December, 2001 to do that. They then have until July, 2002 to complete the move.
http://www.att.com/press/item/0,1354,2927,00.html

Anybody know anything about the timing of the minority interest sale?

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 4:39 pm

the selling of it's RR stake might happen alot sooner then planned read

http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,2630993,00.html

Kip Patterson · Post by **Kip Patterson** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 5:27 pm

Thanks for the article, good catch. It actually refers to the ATT stake in Time Warner Entertainment that it got with MediaOne. The Roadrunner stake is over and above that, but it seems like they might do the whole thing at once.

What gets to me is how many bucks go where, and how much of that could be mine if I were smarter, crookeder, or just plain lucky.

Kip Patterson · Post by **Kip Patterson** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 6:36 pm

I did some traces back to nc.rr.com, at noon, 3, and 6 pm. I'm coming in from the other side of the router you listed. 81 ms at noon, with no extra lag associated with the router in question, increasing to 200 at 3, and 400 at six. 400ms will slow a system with a default rwin of 8192 to 20 kbits, and a system with an rwin of 64k to 1.2 mbits max. Gaming, yuck.

With due respect to Bouncer, I still think this is an overloaded circuit. The router backlog just builds to the point where it has throttled everyone back enough to get by.

Azazel · Post by **Azazel** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 7:08 pm

check this out I found this in my bitch in the news groups

Steve B wrote:

Well, from some sources, I have heard that since the complaints are growing abou
the 24.88.3.149 router(that I originally started posting about bvecause
roadrunner certainly is blasie' about it - more on this later), but from what I
have heard is that roadrunner down in the carlolinas and georgia are bitching
about this router that is supposedly in Virginia somewhere, and the attitude
that the network people in VA are taking is "Ok, we know we have a
problem....so?" This is alledgedly what roadrunner down in these areas are
saying. Regardless of whose fault it is, roadrunner should be ashamed of such an
attitude. It has clearly been a long term problem and regardless of what others
are saying about"giving them the beenfit of the doubt" i say "what happens when
they have another problem, will it take 2 monts to fix that one?" ANd for those
saying we are getting better than 56K speeds I say "if i wanted ISDN speeds, I
would pay $16 a month for ISDN" not $40 for ISDN-like speeds.

Like I mentioned earlier, it also seems, that I no longer have access to ANY
roadrunner newsgroup in the nc. Hmmm....kind of odd sondidering I was one of the
people who started most of the bitch sessions on the grous and threatened to
take it outside. I will continue to do so. Big nusiness continues to get more
rich off of uneducated users who think they are getting a great deal and these
big businesses continue a downward trend to sell declining service. Like the
auto industry - they werent making money of off selling cars that could last 20
years, so what did they do? Naturally, make cars with high performance complex
engins that can have a multitude of problems and have a 5 - 7 yeat serivce life
so people can buy more and more, and in the interim, raise prices. The analogy
to roadrunner is tell people we will garuntee 2mb down stream to your modem from
our network(which could be one or two hops away)because they never say where
from in their network. Apparently, it isnt from anywhere outside of 24.88.3.149.

aldamon · Post by **aldamon** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 7:37 pm

OK, now how do we take this to the next level? I am in Durham, NC and I would gladly help any group coordinate and log an official complaint.

Cable Guy · Post by **Cable Guy** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 7:44 pm

My friend complains about the same thing!

------------------
Its the CableGuy!

aldamon · Post by **aldamon** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 7:46 pm

BTW, here's a screenshot of a traceroute to Yahoo. It's 7:45 PM EST:

Yes, the offending router is in Herndon, Virginia, not Atlanta, though Atlanta shows problems too....

[This message has been edited by aldamon (edited 09-25-2000).]

iBringPain · Post by **iBringPain** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 7:56 pm

Just a dumb question.. Why is it required to take so many hops? Is there not a way to get to a server and reduce all the hops? Someone please explain this to me.... Thanks in advance.

Bouncer · Post by **Bouncer** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 9:07 pm

Hmm...

I just did a visual route check and all I can tell you for sure is that the router in Herndon is acting rather strangely.

See, usually a path is developed between point a and point b, and from then on packets flow down that path barring one of the hops in the path having a problem. That's TCP/IP in a nutshell.

However, I can now WATCH the Herndon router try multiple routes between me and the destination before settling on one. It's as if it is treating every packet as a UDP and just shuttling it out the interface without doing any path determination.

Very odd. Hmm... did some more tracing...

It's like..how do I explain this...Mediaone customers, as opposed to popping out of the RR network onto a backbone... are being routed to @home, which is then routing the packet and eventually putting it on their backbone. The routing is VERY flaky, since it seems to be connectionless...there's no set path in the Herndon router to the @home network so ANY traffic from mediaone subnets has to be dynamically routed to @home.

VERY strange way to go about it, and not very efficient. As a result MO customers suffer a huge lag spike there, and I wouldn't be surprised if the additional overhead all these special routes are imposing also fell on the Time-Warner customers who are routed through there.
It doesn't appear to be cacheing any routes.

BTW, I do apologize. I misspoke myself when I referenced all of RR customer base. I was thinking of the Mediaone folks.

Regards,
-Bouncer-

------------------
"Yeah Baby, YEAH!!!"

[This message has been edited by Bouncer (edited 09-25-2000).]

Prey521 · Post by **Prey521** » Mon Sep 25, 2000 9:19 pm

Originally posted by iBringPain:
Just a dumb question.. Why is it required to take so many hops? Is there not a way to get to a server and reduce all the hops? Someone please explain this to me.... Thanks in advance.

That really has nothin to do with you but with your ISP and whom they use as there backbones.