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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051119/ap_ ... to_lawsuit

SAN FRANCISCO, Calif. - An atheist who has spent four years trying to ban the Pledge of Allegiance from being recited in public schools is now challenging the motto printed on U.S. currency because it refers to God.

Newdow, a Sacramento doctor and lawyer, used a similar argument when he challenged the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools because it contains the words "under God."

He took his pledge fight to the U.S. Supreme Court, which in 2004 said he lacked standing to bring the case because he did not have custody of the daughter he sued on behalf of.

Does this really surprise anyone? It's been said multiple times that after they win one battle, they'll keep going and going until every reference to God is taken out of public.

Lol Liberalslolol

ToxicSplooge wrote:http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051119/ap_ ... to_lawsuit

Does this really surprise anyone? It's been said multiple times that after they win one battle, they'll keep going and going until every reference to God is taken out of public.

Heh. I love how inaccurate the article is to start with, and then all the mudslinging that they do within.

With a biased source like that, it doesn't suprise me that you think like you do. But you keep on truckin' in fantasy-land.

Since our money is issued by the Federal Reserve. And the Federal Reserve is NOT the federal government of the united states. Yeah you figure it out.

I would think those that believe in god would want his name off of money.

whats the big deal...its still gonna be money. Why would you want God's name on a bill filled with Masonic symbols anyways.


Pie

You know I concider myself to be a Christian, but I do not attend church and I might not say a prayer every day (or all week for that matter), but I really have a problem with this line of action.

Why we as a country allow this politically correct crap to go on is beyond me. I mean listen, this country was founded by a group of people who had a strong belief in God. It is ingrained in our history. Every aspect of our founding documents where based on the lessons learned within the Holy Bible. Suing to have the under God and such removed is just plain stupid. It would be like me living in Japan and sueing the Japan government for any and all references to Budda, just because it wasn't my way of thought.

I just cant figure out why people are so ready to backdown from a VERY small group of people who want to force their minority view of religion on the rest of the citizens. No one is forcing him to believe in God, or forcing him to go to church or repeat the whole pledge of allegiance ect.

Hey if I go somewhere and someone wants to say a blessing to the Egyptian god Ra for the meal, I wont join them but I will stand by quietly out of respect for others and let them do their thing. Just because our currency has God printed on it (like from the beginning of the country) doesn't mean that you are forced to start believing. Frankly I dont care if you ever believe in my God, just dont try to erase what our country was founded on.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness...."

and lets not forget.. an oldy but a goodie....

"The Ratification of the Conventions of nine States, shall be sufficient for the Establishment of this Constitution between the States so ratifying the Same.
done in Convention by the Unanimous Consent of the States present the Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven and of the Independence of the United States of America the Twelfth In witness whereof We have hereunto subscribed our Names,...."

and finally...

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof...."

thepieman wrote:whats the big deal...its still gonna be money. Why would you want God's name on a bill filled with Masonic symbols anyways.


Pie

Now your opening a can of whoop ass. Let go buddy, start slinging the crap about how anti-Christian the Masons are, cause you get it I am a Mason and a Christian.

The ironic thing is in the new testament Jesus mentioned about money and it had a picture of Ceasar...and he was not too happy about it. So do you really think he would approve of having God's name next to our Presidents? That like idoltry if you think about it.

BroncoSport wrote:Now your opening a can of whoop ass. Let go buddy, start slinging the crap about how anti-Christian the Masons are, cause you get it I am a Mason and a Christian.

Please do not take offense from the following.... But everytime I hear of masonry, I have to read this diddy for a few chuckles....
http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0093/0093_01.asp

BTW... I have three Jewish friends who are masons.

Augustus wrote:The ironic thing is in the new testament Jesus mentioned about money and it had a picture of Ceasar...and he was not too happy about it. So do you really think he would approve of having God's name next to our Presidents? That like idoltry if you think about it.

Not even close man. Jesus was responding to a question on whether or not the Romans had the authority to tax the Jews and he said "Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's render unto God that which is God's."

ScottE wrote: Not even close man. Jesus was responding to a question on whether or not the Romans had the authority to tax the Jews and he said "Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's render unto God that which is God's."

depends how you interpret it might want to reread it...

then again there are 1,000 different sects of christianity so i doubt anyone will agree on anything.

Newdow is an idiot and once again GH misinterprets another biblical scripture! Ah, I missed a lot today, Splooge is on a roll!

Prey521 wrote: Ah, I missed a lot today, Splooge is on a roll!

The motto in question first appeared on US currency in 1864. The "under G-d" phrase in the 1950's. But this is old hat already. Frankly, it is all a smoke screen. Just another non-starter for the right-wingers to rope in the indignant pious.

Prey521 wrote:Newdow is an idiot and once again GH misinterprets another biblical scripture! Ah, I missed a lot today, Splooge is on a roll!

interpretation is subjective...


anyway...read it closer..see if you can find a deeper meaning, unless you take everything literal?


here is the scripture:

15Then the Pharisees went out and laid plans to trap him in his words. 16They sent their disciples to him along with the Herodians. "Teacher," they said, "we know you are a man of integrity and that you teach the way of God in accordance with the truth. You aren't swayed by men, because you pay no attention to who they are. 17Tell us then, what is your opinion? Is it right to pay taxes to Caesar or not?"

18But Jesus, knowing their evil intent, said, "You hypocrites, why are you trying to trap me? 19Show me the coin used for paying the tax." They brought him a denarius, 20and he asked them, "Whose portrait is this? And whose inscription?"

21"Caesar's," they replied.
Then he said to them, "Give to Caesar what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's."

22When they heard this, they were amazed. So they left him and went away.


How I interpret this is money belongs to Caesar...and do not concern yourself with money, but worry about doing good deeds for God. So if that the case then why would you care about putting these words on money? especailly when god does not care about money. It is of no value.

Instead of spending all this time and worries, worry more about helping the less unfortunate.

Hell_Yes wrote:Please do not take offense from the following.... But everytime I hear of masonry, I have to read this diddy for a few chuckles....
http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0093/0093_01.asp

BTW... I have three Jewish friends who are masons.

I have seen this crap before. A very close friend of mine, who at the time was caught up in the local Pentecostal <sp? church had it given to him. I read it, just as I read this cartoon. And from a person who has attained ALL of the degrees in Mansonry I can tell you that it is all bunk.

Now I will not argue that there were rogue lodges back in time that did what ever they wanted but 99% of the anti Mason stuff comes from way out there churches that preach our way or the highway. Like the Pentecostals, Southern Baptist, Temple Baptist, Nazarene...ect. They have been spreading this for years, trying to shed a bad light on Masonry. BTW they say similar things about Catholics as well....

Strangly enough, if the cartoon was correct... then we "devil worshipers" have a funny way of showing it. Every one of the degrees derive from a historical part of the Old Testement and are used to teach morals and virtue. Shriners give hours and hours or thier time and money to supply ANY child teh hospital care they require...for FREE. Locally we do fundraisers for the poor during the holidays...

Where the majority of these nasayers have teh problem stems from the fact that Masonry does not require that you believe in the Christian God. You can be a hindue, budist blah blah blah, but no atheist are allowed. Reason for this is because of the oath taken a believe in a higher being must be present for the oath to be valid. Kinda like swearing in a court on the Bible. Now they dont like this because we dont enforce Cristian only...and therefor we are made out to be anti God.

Masons are the pillars of the community.. Men from oil fiend workers for sucessful businessmen, from doctors to thier patients. But at lodge all present are equal. In my 13 years, as a member, I can honestly say that I have grown up a lot. A better respect for family, friends county and God. Yes my God (the Christian one).

We have over the years had many a round regarding Masonry, here on Speedguide. And most of the time when I take the time to chime in, I remind those present to not judge something you have not experienced yourself and are only using the retoric of a very few out there in kookoo land.

BroncoSport wrote:Now your opening a can of whoop ass. Let go buddy, start slinging the crap about how anti-Christian the Masons are, cause you get it I am a Mason and a Christian.

I dunno I thought a lot of those symbols arose from something sort of paganistic. The pyramid, the eye...certainly not Christian symbols. I dunno if they are actually masonic in origin but they for sure don't represent anything as far as God or Christianity is concerned.

You also said it yourself...that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator It doesn't specifically say "God" it says THEIR Creator...who is THEIR? is it only intended for Christians? Catholics maybe? Maybe just the Puritans? I thought Jesus was pissed off at the money changers in Israel!?? Why would he want his fathers name on a dollar bill anyway?


Pie

As far as the Masonic symbols and being a direct Christian symbol... Well yes and no. The majority of the sysmbols on our money are Masonic in nature but indirectly Christian. Masonry deals with a tremendous amount of sybolism. It was to help fellow masons with an easier way with the required memorization and also while the degrees are being confered they are used similar to the parables in the Bible. Helps people understand and remember the moral lessons learned. For example "the eye" is concidered by Masons to be the "all seeing eye of God". And since ALL of the degrees and lessons within Masonry are based on the old testament or the Holy Bible....the eye belongs to the Christian God.
FYI


I was not the one who said "that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator ". The founders of our country said this in in the declaration of independance, July 4th 1776. Just which creator do you really believe they were refering to?

Besides which, its not like the money says GOD in big letters across the bill. It just has the motto, "In God we Trust". What so wrong with reminding our citizens and the rest of the world what the backbone of our society is. Do you really think that the USA would have flourished for the last 2 decades, if it weren't for the rules presented to us within the Bible? While I will not force others to believe in what I believe, I do think its is nessesary to maintain the presence of what our country was founded on.

These sue happy losers have nothing better to do than try to disrupt the majority of our society and impose their MINORITY view on everyone else. The way I see it is, here is our country...this is what were all about... dont like it...LEAVE or shut up and stop messing it up for the rest of us. Noone is holding a gun to his head and forcing him to church. He isn't suffering mental anguish becuase the money he has in his wallet has God printed on it.

[quote="BroncoSport"]Besides which, its not like the money says GOD in big letters across the bill. It just has the motto, "In God we Trust". What so wrong with reminding our citizens and the rest of the world what the backbone of our society is. Do you really think that the USA would have flourished for the last 2 decades, if it weren't for the rules presented to us within the Bible? While I will not force others to believe in what I believe, I do think its is nessesary to maintain the presence of what our country was founded on.

These sue happy losers have nothing better to do than try to disrupt the majority of our society and impose their MINORITY view on everyone else. The way I see it is, here is our country...this is what were all about... dont like it...LEAVE or shut up and stop messing it up for the rest of us. Noone is holding a gun to his head and forcing him to church. He isn't suffering mental anguish becuase the money he has in his wallet has God printed on it. ]


backbone ?


I thought freedom of religion came in to play somehow



this situation is silly all the way around ...this guy is no better than some bible banger trying to force their garbage down our throats

vc_wannabe wrote:Since our money is issued by the Federal Reserve. And the Federal Reserve is NOT the federal government of the united states. Yeah you figure it out.

The Feds still have the say so of what our currency looks like.

exactly!

thepieman wrote:whats the big deal...its still gonna be money. Why would you want God's name on a bill filled with Masonic symbols anyways.


Pie

[quote="BroncoSport"]Besides which, its not like the money says GOD in big letters across the bill. It just has the motto, "In God we Trust". What so wrong with reminding our citizens and the rest of the world what the backbone of our society is. Do you really think that the USA would have flourished for the last 2 decades, if it weren't for the rules presented to us within the Bible? While I will not force others to believe in what I believe, I do think its is nessesary to maintain the presence of what our country was founded on.

These sue happy losers have nothing better to do than try to disrupt the majority of our society and impose their MINORITY view on everyone else. The way I see it is, here is our country...this is what were all about... dont like it...LEAVE or shut up and stop messing it up for the rest of us. Noone is holding a gun to his head and forcing him to church. He isn't suffering mental anguish becuase the money he has in his wallet has God printed on it. ]



How is anyone forcing views on you? Can you still worship your God? Is passing this law going to stop you from going to Church or wherever you go?

Will this stop you from celebrating your holidays in your home?


God does not care about things such as this, it is all material possesions. do you really think God cares if his name is printed on money? money that is used to fund wars and kill people for example.

knightmare wrote:exactly!

Oh man....

(ok, just got back but,)

the eye*, is the eye of Horus. What degree are you Bronco? When you become illuminated you will learn who the masonic God is.
The KJV is in fact, used as the masonic bible. Translated by a illuminated king, who believed in the divine rulership of kings. How much was mistranslated, etc.?

BroncoSport wrote:As far as the Masonic symbols and being a direct Christian symbol... Well yes and no. The majority of the sysmbols on our money are Masonic in nature but indirectly Christian. Masonry deals with a tremendous amount of sybolism. It was to help fellow masons with an easier way with the required memorization and also while the degrees are being confered they are used similar to the parables in the Bible. Helps people understand and remember the moral lessons learned. For example "the eye" is concidered by Masons to be the "all seeing eye of God". And since ALL of the degrees and lessons within Masonry are based on the old testament or the Holy Bible....the eye belongs to the Christian God.
FYI


I was not the one who said "that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator ". The founders of our country said this in in the declaration of independance, July 4th 1776. Just which creator do you really believe they were refering to?

BroncoSport wrote:
Hey if I go somewhere and someone wants to say a blessing to the Egyptian god Ra for the meal, I wont join them but I will stand by quietly out of respect for others and let them do their thing.

And there lies the whole problemo.

Peoples lack of respect for others.

Don't agree with you much Bronco, but excellent post

Chris wrote:
And there lies the whole problemo.

Peoples lack of respect for others.

Don't agree with you much Bronco, but excellent post

couldn't have said it better myself

you're right Chris, i respect that it is someone's belief. But as far as convincing me it is the truth....there is a rip in the fabric of time.

Chris wrote:
And there lies the whole problemo.

Peoples lack of respect for others.

Don't agree with you much Bronco, but excellent post

knightmare wrote:you're right Chris, i respect that it is someone's belief. But as far as convincing me it is the truth....there is a rip in the fabric of time.

Correctemundo, I have no problem with peoples beliefs to each their own, just don't say I'm wrong for mine, although I myself am also guilty of falling into the mudslinging at times,

man if that idiot doesn't belive in God then what hte hell does he care? It could say in Santa Clause we trust and it shouldn't matter to him. Since he doesnt' belive god exists at all....

Moron....

These idiots need to STFU....if you don't like it....use a freaking debit card....

just another loser idiot with too much time on his hands stirring up all the other idiots with too much time on their hands.