American Cars suck!

TEH WIN · Post by **TEH WIN** » Sat May 31, 2003 2:57 am

Yes, it's true, they finally admit it!

http://www.freep.com/money/autonews/gm29_20030529.htm

BaLa · Post by **BaLa** » Sat May 31, 2003 5:40 am

Post by **YeOldeStonecat** » Sat May 31, 2003 6:08 am

Huh, I would have chosen the 70's and 80's as their bad years, they chose the 80's and the 90's.

minir · Post by **minir** » Sat May 31, 2003 6:50 am

Hi TEH WIN

Not to mention some of the Most Ugly Cars as well.

regards

minir

Post by **YeOldeStonecat** » Sat May 31, 2003 7:09 am

Originally posted by minir
Hi TEH WIN

Not to mention some of the Most Ugly Cars as well.

regards

minir

Yer not talking about the....

...AMC Matador are you? LOL

blebs · Post by **blebs** » Sat May 31, 2003 7:41 am

The Matador was ugly but what about that there Pacer?

SGTMAJRET · Post by **SGTMAJRET** » Sat May 31, 2003 8:06 am

.....and the Gremlin

EvilAngel · Post by **EvilAngel** » Sat May 31, 2003 9:01 am

gimme any 1900 - 1971 car anyday.

chevyman282 · Post by **chevyman282** » Sat May 31, 2003 9:14 am

Originally posted by YeOldeStonecat
Huh, I would have chosen the 70's and 80's as their bad years, they chose the 80's and the 90's.

I would have to agree with YeOldeStonecat, any one remember the Chevrolet Vega? Built in Lordstown OH...

There was an early recall of 132,000 cars to correct a carburetor fire hazard. Aluminum cylinder blocks were subject to distortion due to overheating, cylinders were prone to premature wear causing high oil consumption, and the lightweight block caused noise and vibration. In addition to all this, the body proved vulnerable to rust.

That car came out in 1970 and yes I bought one and hated it!
I am a much smarter and savvy shopper now!

chevy....

brembo · Post by **brembo** » Sat May 31, 2003 9:22 am

Two words....

Pontiac Aztec.

Yeah it's a newer model, but geezus it's ugly.

the_mp3_refuge · Post by **the_mp3_refuge** » Sat May 31, 2003 10:44 am

American Cars ROCK! All you boys with your rice burners i'm sure could kick my @$$ in any race but hell if you ever run into some "real" muddy, rocky terrain give me a call and I'll bring my American Made 5.7L V8 Dakota and tow your damn neon filled high piched cars out cuz I know no way a civic could even handle half the stuff i've cruzed over.

American Cars 4 LIFE!

porkchop · Post by **porkchop** » Sat May 31, 2003 10:49 am

Originally posted by the_mp3_refuge
American Cars ROCK! All you boys with your rice burners i'm sure could kick my @$$ in any race but hell if you ever run into some "real" muddy, rocky terrain give me a call and I'll bring my American Made 5.7L V8 Dakota and tow your damn neon filled high piched cars out cuz I know no way a civic could even handle half the stuff i've cruzed over.

American Cars 4 LIFE!

Rice burners? Oh COME ON... LOL u racist jackass...

Rice pwns j00...

Blisster · Post by **Blisster** » Sat May 31, 2003 12:38 pm

My american car don't suck.....

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Sat May 31, 2003 12:41 pm

Originally posted by Blisster
My american car don't suck.....

ya urs just blows lol

Blisster · Post by **Blisster** » Sat May 31, 2003 12:46 pm

Originally posted by YARDofSTUF
ya urs just blows lol

yeah, it blows most any other production car in its price range off the road, and looks damn good while doing it. (well, it would if it was a coupe, being a drop-top it is much heavier, so a bit slower, but hey I wanted style and balls!)

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Sat May 31, 2003 12:48 pm

horsepowertv had a thing where they took a 96 mustang convertable and put a flowmasterexhuast on it, adn new intake something or other, and it gave them like 25 more horsepower, for a pretty good price too.

Blisster · Post by **Blisster** » Sat May 31, 2003 12:52 pm

Yeah, modding the exhaust/intake system is on my shortlist of things to do. Unfortunately with the economy in the *****ter I haven't enjoyed the amount of work that would allow me to afford certain luxuries like upgrades on my car, etc.

I'm hoping to do a few minor upgrades before the year is out, we'll see.

Blisster · Post by **Blisster** » Sat May 31, 2003 12:53 pm

Originally posted by porkchop
Rice burners? Oh COME ON... LOL u racist jackass...

Rice pwns j00...

thats not really a racist term, EVERYONE calls em Rice rockets or rice burners. Hell that term has been around since I was a youngster.

Post by **YeOldeStonecat** » Sat May 31, 2003 12:53 pm

Originally posted by chevyman282
any one remember the Chevrolet Vega? Built in Lordstown OH...

Yeah GM had a lot of models based on that one. Chevy Vega, Pontiac Astre, Buick had one too...but I cannot remember it's name. And the other sport bodied variant, the Chevy Monza. I don't remember the carb recall, but that engine saw duty for many years...the good old 2.5 liter "Iron Duke". Was around the the 60's, til well into the later 80's, early 90's perhaps.

Remember those first years of the Ford Escort/Mercury Lynx? Wow what junk, little 1.6 liter or something. Yet Ford of Germany did a good little one, the Fiesta! That little thing could boogie.

Ford "Maveric"....UGH! Even it's musclecar version....the "Grabber".

Anyone remember the rare "Cosworth Vega"? Very tweaked engine in it with some racing mods.

"The Matador was ugly but what about that there Pacer?"

Yeah, that was an odd one. Big bubble.

Anyone remember AMC's little pony car...the AMX? Just saw a nicely restored one the other day.

JawZ · Post by **JawZ** » Sat May 31, 2003 12:54 pm

Originally posted by Blisster
yeah, it blows most any other production car in its price range off the road, and looks damn good while doing it. (well, it would if it was a coupe, being a drop-top it is much heavier, so a bit slower, but hey I wanted style and balls!)

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

torsten · Post by **torsten** » Sat May 31, 2003 3:54 pm

Is the truth finally catching up to them?
It's hilarious that GM is complaining that 40% of buyers won't consider their cars because they prefer cars made by European or Asian companies. That shrewd 40% is far outnumbered by the idiots who have bought junk for years just because it's American. GM has remained in business solely because of their charity/stupidity.

"rice" isn't racist, but it IS stupid. Usually a way for those with badly engineered cars to boost self-esteem by looking "down" on superior ones.

YARDofSTUF · Post by **YARDofSTUF** » Sat May 31, 2003 4:08 pm

Originally posted by UOD
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

unless someone steals that eye and the beholder is left there blind as hell, and some theif has the beauty.

RoundEye · Post by **RoundEye** » Sat May 31, 2003 4:34 pm

Saying "American cars suck" is like saying "all foreign cars are rice". Almost all car manufactures have a car that I bet they wished they hadn't produced.

Early Jaguar's were an electrical nightmare, anybody remember Lucas? Some diesel Mercedes had an injector pump that was a horror to overhaul and cost about a half billion dollars to do. Some people like Nissan but I think some of them are junk, early Maxima's had that system that talked to you, I've seen tons of problems with those and the interior of the cars fell apart too. The 300ZX intake picked up air from underneath the front bumper of the car, may not be much of a problem in other parts of the world, but I've seen more then one ZX with a blown motor from sucking up water off the street around here. Mid 1980's Toyota Celicas were rust buckets too, they would rust all around the hatchback and fender wells.

I've worked on tons of different cars and could go on and on about problems or design flaws with them all. When I worked at Confederate motorcycles I seen first hand what it's like to take and idea on paper, and make it work on a vehicle. It's not an easy thing to do.

Bottom line is that many foreign cars are disposable, they may last a while, but once they are used up that's it. Throw it away.

How many foreign cars do you see from the 50's, 60's or 70's being restored? In fact how many foreign cars do you see that are more then 20 years old running around on the street? Who wants to restore a 1970 Honda Accord?

American cars may not be the best built in the world, but they sure as hell do have staying power.

koldchillah · Post by **koldchillah** » Sat May 31, 2003 6:27 pm

I can't wait to get rid of my Acura Legend and get an American 4WD Truck or SUV.. Foreign cars seem a bit more expensive to fix and more expensive to buy, at least from what I've seen...

Both my parents have always owned Chevy Blazers. First an '88 s-10 blazer that lasted 234,000 miles, then was replaced by a '94 blazer which my parents have driven from south florida to montana 3 times, colorado twice, california once, arizona twice, ohio once, and west virginia 5 or 6 times (all on separate trips) and its now getting close to 240,000 miles and is in absolutely mint condition and looks EXACTLY like the day they bought it.. My mom is just now wanting to trade it in for a suburban, but she says she's still waiting for the blazer to break down.. lol

bottom line is.. you take care of a vehicle properly, even a domestic GM from the 80's or 90's can last a long time and the upkeep can even turn out a lot cheaper in the long run.

I'm not knockin' foreign cars.. my wife's honda civic del sol seems a solid car, I just think GM deserves a bit more credit in some cases.

porkchop · Post by **porkchop** » Sat May 31, 2003 6:39 pm

Originally posted by Blisster
thats not really a racist term, EVERYONE calls em Rice rockets or rice burners. Hell that term has been around since I was a youngster.

I was joking... lol...

nepenthe · Post by **nepenthe** » Sat May 31, 2003 9:09 pm

Originally posted by EvilAngel
gimme any 1900 - 1971 car anyday.

<spooge>

My brother has my mom's 1970 white on white GTO convertible. Gosh, they made some pretty cars during the muscle era.

American manufacturing has utilized off the shelf parts for far too long. The Corvette is a beautiful auto, but its engine block is over 30 years old. I could forgive the mid-seventies to early eighties as the US played catch up to the world for fuel efficient designs, however there is genuinely no excuse for not being able to engineer and produce a vehicle that can compete with the Accord or Camry. Is it so difficult to examine Japanese techniques and emulate them?

shant,
david

Post by **YeOldeStonecat** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 12:48 pm

Originally posted by nepenthe
Gosh, they made some pretty cars during the muscle era.

there is genuinely no excuse for not being able to engineer and produce a vehicle that can compete with the Accord or Camry. Is it so difficult to examine Japanese techniques and emulate them?

shant,
david

Yeah, I love the 67, 68, and 70 Camaro's. Also the Cuda's...sexy!

Work ethics I guess...the US work force generally has no pride in it's work...no striving to built it with quality, no pride in craftmanship. Always union rules and minimal effort needed to just get by. That's the production side you see on the surface.

As for designing/engineering...always looking to economize..meaning take an older design and try to improve it. No "starting from scratch".

Post by **YeOldeStonecat** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 12:48 pm

Originally posted by nepenthe
Gosh, they made some pretty cars during the muscle era.

there is genuinely no excuse for not being able to engineer and produce a vehicle that can compete with the Accord or Camry. Is it so difficult to examine Japanese techniques and emulate them?

shant,
david

Yeah, I love the 67, 68, and 70 Camaro's. Also the Cuda's...sexy!

Work ethics I guess...the US work force generally has no pride in it's work...no striving to built it with quality, no pride in craftmanship. Always union rules and minimal effort needed to just get by. That's the production side you see on the surface.

As for designing/engineering...always looking to economize..meaning take an older design and try to improve it. No "starting from scratch".

Post by **YeOldeStonecat** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 12:48 pm

Originally posted by nepenthe
Gosh, they made some pretty cars during the muscle era.

there is genuinely no excuse for not being able to engineer and produce a vehicle that can compete with the Accord or Camry. Is it so difficult to examine Japanese techniques and emulate them?

shant,
david

Yeah, I love the 67, 68, and 70 Camaro's. Also the Cuda's...sexy!

Work ethics I guess...the US work force generally has no pride in it's work...no striving to built it with quality, no pride in craftmanship. Always union rules and minimal effort needed to just get by. That's the production side you see on the surface.

As for designing/engineering...always looking to economize..meaning take an older design and try to improve it. No "starting from scratch".

RoundEye · Post by **RoundEye** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 1:00 pm

Stonecat, put down the crack pipe and step away from the keyboard, NOW!

teaaememy · Post by **teaaememy** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 1:24 pm

American cars don't suck thats stereo typing all american cars because of GM. I will tell you what sucks more than American cars....
BUYING FOREIGN PARTS!!!

nepenthe · Post by **nepenthe** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 3:44 pm

Originally posted by teaaememy
American cars don't suck thats stereo typing all american cars because of GM. I will tell you what sucks more than American cars....
BUYING FOREIGN PARTS!!!

Ford and Chrysler are also guilty of using engine block designs that are decades old. Off the self seems to be the credo of most American car designers. I do not blame the American assemblers.

shant,
david

Post by **YeOldeStonecat** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 5:26 pm

Originally posted by teaaememy
American cars don't suck thats stereo typing all american cars because of GM. I will tell you what sucks more than American cars....
BUYING FOREIGN PARTS!!!

Funny, I defined the worst of the American auto industry with Lee Io's years at the helm of Chrysler....the early K-Cars and Omni/Horizons. Ugh...didn't get much uglier or worse quality than that...those 2.2 liter engines guaranteed to fail at the 60k mark, trailing blue clouds of burning oil everywhere.