RWIN Won't Change-OOL 15mps

GoOffroad · Post by **GoOffroad** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 12:09 pm

Hey,
Just got OOL yesterday and already trying optimize everything. I've tried using DRTCP-CableNuts-TCPOptimizer.

They all say they've changed the RWIN value from the 65700 to 375220 or more. After restart though and doing the TCP/IP Analyzer or tweak test they say it has not been changed at all from the 65536.

I have no clue what's going on so any help is very much appreciated.

Thanks

« SpeedGuide.net TCP Analyzer Results »
Tested on: 03.21.2007 12:04
IP address:

TCP options string: 020405b40103030201010402
MSS: 1460
MTU: 1500
TCP Window: 65700 (multiple of MSS)
RWIN Scaling: 2
Unscaled RWIN : 16425
Reccomended RWINs: 64240, 128480, 256960, 513920
BDP limit (200ms): 2628kbps (329KBytes/s)
BDP limit (500ms): 1051kbps (131KBytes/s)
MTU Discovery: ON
TTL: 113
Timestamps: OFF
SACKs: ON
IP ToS: 00000000 (0)

trogers · Post by **trogers** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 12:13 pm

RWIN at 65536 means you are using Vista which does not have a TCP/IP stack that can be tweaked. Vista has an auto-tuning function that adjust RWIN to suit the latency of your connections.

GoOffroad · Post by **GoOffroad** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 12:20 pm

So I have no control at all? Damn Vista

Guess I shouldn't complain.

mccoffee · Post by **mccoffee** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 12:31 pm

Trogers is right though you should be able to change the rwin 65536 doesn't always mean vista troggers that is also the defualt for xp and 98 2k i think too just a friendly reminder fyi

The auto tunning stack is greatly inmproved by microsoft though in it's latest version of vista it may not need it in some case you may want to try it though depending on your cicrumstances.

Did you reboot after saving changes ????

mccoffee · Post by **mccoffee** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 12:40 pm

I'm humbly pround to admit i've made a mistake after looking at my vista machine tha tis tweak he is right you might be stuck.

MTU is optimized for PPoE DSL broadband. If not, consider raising MTU to 1500 for optimal throughput.
[url=javascript:// What is mss ?]MSS[/url] = 1452
MSS is optimized for PPPoE DSL broadband. If not, consider raising your MTU value.
[url=javascript:// What is RWIN ?]Default TCP Receive Window (RWIN)[/url] = 66792
RWIN Scaling (RFC1323) = 2 bits (scale factor of 4)
Unscaled TCP Receive Window = 16698

RWIN is not fully optimized (even though it is a comparatively large number). The unscaled RWIN value is lower than it should be. Also, RWIN being close to and above 65535 does not justify the header overhead of enabling TCP 1323 Options. You might want to use one of the recommended RWIN values below.

RWIN is a multiple of MSS
Other RWIN values that might work well with your current MTU/MSS:
511104 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 8)
255552 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 4)
127776 (MSS x 44 * scale factor of 2)
63888 (MSS x 44)
bandwidth * delay product (Note this is not a speed test):

Your TCP Window limits you to: 2672 kbps (334 KBytes/s) @ 200ms
Your TCP Window limits you to: 1069 kbps (134 KBytes/s) @ 500ms
[url=javascript:// What is MTU ?]MTU Discovery (RFC1191)[/url] = ON
[url=javascript:// What is TTL ?]Time to live left[/url] = 47 hops
TTL value is ok.
[url=javascript:// What is Timestamps ?]Timestamps (RFC1323)[/url] = OFF[url=javascript:// What is SackOpts ?]Selective Acknowledgements (RFC2018)[/url] = ON
IP type of service field (RFC1349) = 00000000 (0)

mccoffee · Post by **mccoffee** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 12:45 pm

After a second check over the settings i noticed that windows scailing was not on what's odd though I set it to 1 in cablenut its like vista ingores it totally hmm..

Not sure why it's just ingoring it this requires me to do some reasearch and some more testing it's odd.

mccoffee · Post by **mccoffee** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 1:21 pm

after digging I found this phill is going to have his work cut out for him he he.

Changes to TCP/IP Registry Values

Many of the TCP/IP registry values supported in Windows XP and Windows Server 2003 are not supported by TCP/IP in Windows Vista and Windows Server “Longhorn.” You can configure additional TCP/IP settings with command-line parameters for the following Netsh commands at a Windows command prompt with administrator-level permissions:
·netsh interface ipv4 set interface
·netsh interface ipv4 set global
·netsh interface ipv6 set interface
·netsh interface ipv6 set global

GoOffroad · Post by **GoOffroad** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 1:49 pm

i guess vista users will have to wait and see...thanks for the help

trogers · Post by **trogers** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 9:58 pm

mccoffee wrote:Trogers is right though you should be able to change the rwin 65536 doesn't always mean vista troggers that is also the defualt for xp and 98 2k i think too just a friendly reminder fyi

Windows default RWIN value for the older operating systems before Vista is 65535.

So when I see any TCP Analyzer reporting RWIN at 65536, and especially with small unscaled RWIN, somtimes starting at 256, I would suspect the OS is Vista.

100 010 00 · Post by **100 010 00** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 3:39 am

trogers wrote:Windows default RWIN value for the older operating systems before Vista is 65535.

17520 is the right value for the default rwin

trogers · Post by **trogers** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:49 am

100 010 00 wrote:17520 is the right value for the default rwin

Nope. Default RWIN in Windows means an untweaked RWIN value produced by an original Window Registry.

17520 is a tweaked value for MTU 1500 (MSS x 12) and is not optimum for other MTUs like 1492 or less.

mccoffee · Post by **mccoffee** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 9:33 am

100 010 00 wrote:17520 is the right value for the default rwin

f

the 17520 is the default with scailing on

100 010 00 · Post by **100 010 00** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 9:55 am

Actually default rwin is a routing value. It depends from your bandwidth. It starts from 8192, jumps to 17520 and 65535 for speeds up to 1mbit

mccoffee · Post by **mccoffee** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:13 pm

trogers wrote:Windows default RWIN value for the older operating systems before Vista is 65535.

So when I see any TCP Analyzer reporting RWIN at 65536, and especially with small unscaled RWIN, somtimes starting at 256, I would suspect the OS is Vista.

come to think about your right troggers i'm on crack today and that day

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Fri Oct 24, 2008 8:33 pm

Hi guys,
just found this site, which has some REALLY good info! So glad I found you!

Just built a new PC, and I installed Vista...damn Vista!!!

Same story as everyone else... I get half the speed I was getting with my old XP pc... I've lost my sleep with it!!! Have been looking and searching everything, until I found this post...

Here is my info...

« SpeedGuide.net TCP Analyzer Results »
Tested on: 10.24.2008 20:25

TCP options string: 020405ac01010402
MSS: 1452
MTU: 1492
TCP Window: 65340 (multiple of MSS)
RWIN Scaling: 0 bits
Unscaled RWIN : 65340
Recommended RWINs: 63888, 127776, 255552, 511104, 1022208
BDP limit (200ms): 2614kbps (327KBytes/s)
BDP limit (500ms): 1045kbps (131KBytes/s)
MTU Discovery: ON
TTL: 46
Timestamps: OFF
SACKs: ON
IP ToS: 00000000 (0)

and I'm getting SICK!!! My connection is 6,500-7,000... using my old XP pc I download with 500-600 Kbytes/s... my new Vista (Business 64-bit with SP1 installed) will only download with 300-330 Kbytes/s

Autotuning is off... I run TCPOptimizer, but the value of RWIN does not change!!!

So, is there a solution about it??? Have we come with something around it???

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Fri Oct 24, 2008 10:26 pm

Guys,
I've tried ALL POSSIBLE combinations about it, and still can't find a solution!

But read this please!

"""TCP Auto-Tuning

To turn off the default RWIN auto tuning behavior, (in elevated command prompt) type:

netsh int tcp set global autotuninglevel=disabled

The default auto-tuning level is "normal", and the possible settings for the above command are:

disabled: uses a fixed value for the tcp receive window. Limits it to 64KB (limited at 65535).
higlyrestricted: allows the receive window to grow beyond its default value, very conservatively
restricted: somewhat restricted growth of the tcp receive window beyond its default value
normal: default value, allows the receive window to grow to accommodate most conditions
experimental: allows the receive window to grow to accommodate extreme scenarios (not recommended, it can degrade performance in common scenarios, only intended for research purposes. It enables RWIN values of over 16 MB)"

So if using DISABLED, the TCP RWIN DOES NOT CHANGE VALUE! That gives it a FIXED 64kb.
Even though in the Registry the numbers shown, are the ones you have input in the TCOptimizer... but when you go to
http://www.speedguide.net/analyzer.php
you still get a FREAKING TCP RWIN of 65340...

I also tried the "experimental" mode of auto-tuning, that supposedly leaves it free to grow, but still nothing!!!

HELP ANYONE???

trogers · Post by **trogers** » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:11 pm

Try rebooting the comp after setting autotuning to normal.

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Mon Oct 27, 2008 11:14 pm

So you tell me to have autotuning in "normal" and not in "experimental" which is for very high speeds?

trogers · Post by **trogers** » Mon Oct 27, 2008 11:42 pm

Drlawgr wrote:So you tell me to have autotuning in "normal" and not in "experimental" which is for very high speeds?

Experimental is for experiments.

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Mon Oct 27, 2008 11:51 pm

but only in "experimental" I have this small increase in my speed... I've read that it is used by research institutes to transfer their "stuff"; too large files that need to move at more than 16Mbs...

I'll try what you say though, and keep you posted...

trogers · Post by **trogers** » Tue Oct 28, 2008 12:08 am

Drlawgr wrote:but only in "experimental" I have this small increase in my speed...

Problem may be with signal quality. No amount of tweaks in the comp can compensate.

Do a tracert and post.

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Tue Oct 28, 2008 4:59 pm

Don't know how to do this... can you please give me instructions?

I have also run a small program to unlock increase max connections allowed... can see a description here:

http://www.tipandtrick.net/2008/64-bit- ... s-allowed/

This program also needs Ready Driver Plus... see here:

http://www.tipandtrick.net/2008/permane ... iver-plus/

Can any of this be the problem?

Ok, waiting instructions about how to do this tracert, in order to run and post please...

Thanks a lot!

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Tue Oct 28, 2008 6:04 pm

If "tracert" is what I understood, then the command is (in elevated cmd):

C:\Windows\system32\tracert 192.168.0.1

where 192.168.0.1 is the address I type in Firefox in order to get into my router to change settings...

is that the correct command?

If so, I have less than 1, and less than 1 ms (and I was downloading torrents at the same time)

What I get is the following:

Tracing route to 192.168.0.1 over a maximum of 30 hops
1 1ms <1ms <1ms 192.168.0.1
Trace complete.

Please inform me

PS: my router is with the latest firmware; it's a Netgear DG834GT (Vista compatible)... I've check all drivers of LAN, etc, too...

trogers · Post by **trogers** » Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:45 pm

To do a tracert, click 'Start' and then 'Run'. Type "cmd" into the box and click 'ok'.

A DOS black screen will appear. Type after the C:\>

tracert http://www.yahoo.com

and press enter key

When test is completed, move mouse cursor to the DOS black screen, click right and choose 'select all'.

Move mouse cursor to the Quick Reply box of this forum, click right and 'paste'.

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 5:58 am

This is with Autotuning in "normal":

Microsoft Windows [Version 6.0.6001]
Copyright (c) 2006 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

C:\Windows\system32>tracert http://www.yahoo.com

Tracing route to http://www.yahoo-ht3.akadns.net [87.248.113.14]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.0.1
2 40 ms 40 ms 39 ms bbras-llu-ath-03L0.forthnet.gr [194.219.239.109]

3 40 ms 40 ms 40 ms core-ath-03-Po1.forthnet.gr [212.251.60.62]
4 40 ms 40 ms 40 ms core-ath-08.forthnet.gr [194.219.227.108]
5 90 ms 90 ms 89 ms 212.162.9.137
6 97 ms 90 ms 90 ms ae-32-56.ebr2.Frankfurt1.Level3.net [4.68.118.19
0]
7 96 ms 94 ms 103 ms ae-2.ebr1.Dusseldorf1.Level3.net [4.69.132.137]

8 107 ms 95 ms 103 ms ae-1-100.ebr2.Dusseldorf1.Level3.net [4.69.132.1
30]
9 107 ms 108 ms 108 ms ae-2.ebr1.Amsterdam1.Level3.net [4.69.133.89]
10 100 ms 108 ms 108 ms ae-1-100.ebr2.Amsterdam1.Level3.net [4.69.133.86
]
11 105 ms 106 ms 104 ms ae-2.ebr2.London1.Level3.net [4.69.132.133]
12 111 ms 108 ms 107 ms ae-1-100.ebr1.London1.Level3.net [4.69.132.117]

13 117 ms 116 ms 116 ms ae-5-5.car1.Dublin1.Level3.net [4.69.136.89]
14 121 ms 120 ms 120 ms 213.242.106.30
15 112 ms 119 ms 112 ms ge-1-1.bas-b2.ird.yahoo.com [87.248.101.3]
16 113 ms 112 ms 112 ms f1.us.http://www.vip.ird.yahoo.com [87.248.113.14]

Trace complete.

C:\Windows\system32>

trogers · Post by **trogers** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 1:53 pm

Tracert shows no signal problem at your end. Have you check to see if there is any updated firmware to suit Vista for your Network adapter?

See: http://www.driverstock.com/Network-driv ... index.html

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 7:13 pm

Yes I have check netgear's site, and I have the latest firmware...

Let me ask you 3 questions please...

1) Do the 2 programs I've installed (Ready Driver plus, and the utility for allowing max connections) - that I refer to a previous message of mine on top of page 2 of this post - can interfere negatively, and cause my problem?

2) Can you tell me what are the best settings for the C:\netsh int tcp set global ...... are? Now I have: Enabled - Disabled - normal - ctcp - Enabled - Disabled.

3) I just saw in my router a "table" under UPnP which is the following...

Turn UPnP on (checked)

Advertisement Period (in minutes) : 30
Advertisement Time To Live (in hops) : 4

UPnP Portmap Table
Active Protocol Int. Port Ext. Port IP Address
YES UDP 64369 64369 192.168.0.6

Should I change any of those?

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 7:23 pm

Network adapter is up to date too according to Driver Director 6.3.4.5

I have:

Realtek RTL8169/8110 PCI Gigabit Ethernet NIC (NDIS 6.0)

with:

driver version 6.210.1003.2008

dated: 10/3/2008

I have also UNCHECK: TCP/IPv6, as well as QoS

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:12 pm

from the site you told me I downloaded the Driver updater pro, and this program gives me 18 driver updates, under IDE ATA/ATAPI controllers, Systerm Devices, and USB controllers...

1 of them for example is Intel X48 Express Chipset Processor to I/O controller - 2926...

I go to Intel's site, but can't find any downloads for it (for Vista Business 64 bit, that I have)... the program says that a new driver exists, and that is v9.1.0.1007, dated 8/19/2008... but can't find it anywhere at Intel's site... any place else??? so I can look for the others too?

trogers · Post by **trogers** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 9:24 pm

Drlawgr wrote:Yes I have check netgear's site, and I have the latest firmware...

Let me ask you 3 questions please...

1) Do the 2 programs I've installed (Ready Driver plus, and the utility for allowing max connections) - that I refer to a previous message of mine on top of page 2 of this post - can interfere negatively, and cause my problem?

2) Can you tell me what are the best settings for the C:\netsh int tcp set global ...... are? Now I have: Enabled - Disabled - normal - ctcp - Enabled - Disabled.

3) I just saw in my router a "table" under UPnP which is the following...

Turn UPnP on (checked)

Advertisement Period (in minutes) : 30
Advertisement Time To Live (in hops) : 4

UPnP Portmap Table
Active Protocol Int. Port Ext. Port IP Address
YES UDP 64369 64369 192.168.0.6

Should I change any of those?

Q1: Normal routers can only handle max. no. of simultaneous connections of 64 to 128, dpending on make and model. So I would not set the figure higher than 128.

Q2: Enable both

Q3: Disable UPnP of the router to enhance security. Do manual port forward if required. See http://www.portforward.com

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 10:01 pm

Hello again...

I don't know what happened to my PC, but right now I'm downloading something from the Microsoft site, and downloads with 549 KB/s !!!

The only thing before that was that I downloaded:
Hotfix Microsoft .NET Framework 3.5 SP1 (KB953595)

Do you think that has anything to do with my downloading speed???

Ok... as to your comments...
1) this "Ready Driver Plus" it does not allow Vista to check (on boot up) for Unassigned drivers -or something like that- Do you think I must uninstall it?

2) I gave you all my settings in the Enable/Disable table above, for the netsh int tcp, etc (RSS, Chimney, Autotune, Congestion, ECN, can't remeber the last one)... you say enable both... which ones, both, do you mean? the only disabled are the Chimney, and the last one of the list... you mean to enable these 2 as well?

3) Ok, about this last point...

Since I'm downloading right now as I'm writing to you with the max speed I've ever seen in my PC (same speed as my old XP pc), before I do any changes, I'll wait for your comments...

Thanks

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 10:50 pm

LOOK AT THAT GUYS!!! and I haven't touched a thing (except the installation of this Framework .NET 3.5 SP1)

using the site dslreports.com/tweaks doing the test...

1. Your Tweakable Settings
Receive Window (RWIN): 261360
Window Scaling: 2
Path MTU Discovery: ON
RFC1323 Window Scaling: ON
RFC1323 Time Stamping: OFF
Selective Acks: ON
MSS requested: 1452
TTL: unknown
TTL remaining: 55
TOS flags: none set

2. Test Download
Actual data bytes sent: 1024001
Actual data packets: 714
Max packet sent (MTU): 1492
Max packet recd (MTU): 1492
Retransmitted packets: 0
sacks you sent: 6
pushed data pkts: 43
data transmit time: 4.066 secs
our max idletime: 322.8 ms
transfer rate: 223015 bytes/sec
transfer rate: 1784 kbits/sec
transfer efficiency: 100%

how is that possible??? haven't changed anything!!!

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 12:08 am

Haven't change a thing on my PC since the last test a few minutes ago (see my previous post)...

Just run the test again... and see my results!

1. Your Tweakable Settings
Receive Window (RWIN): 66792
Window Scaling: 2
Path MTU Discovery: ON
RFC1323 Window Scaling: ON
RFC1323 Time Stamping: OFF
Selective Acks: ON
MSS requested: 1452
TTL: unknown
TTL remaining: 55
TOS flags: none set

2. Test Download
Actual data bytes sent: 1050137
Actual data packets: 725
Max packet sent (MTU): 1492
Max packet recd (MTU): 1492
Retransmitted packets: 18
sacks you sent: 72
pushed data pkts: 82
data transmit time: 20.945 secs
our max idletime: 425.0 ms
transfer rate: 47465 bytes/sec
transfer rate: 379 kbits/sec
transfer efficiency: 97%

What the heck is going on?????????????????

Drlawgr · Post by **Drlawgr** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 12:11 am

It has been probably less than 2 minutes (since my last post) I did the test, and I run the test again...

Here are the results...

1. Your Tweakable Settings
Receive Window (RWIN): 261360
Window Scaling: 2
Path MTU Discovery: ON
RFC1323 Window Scaling: ON
RFC1323 Time Stamping: OFF
Selective Acks: ON
MSS requested: 1452
TTL: unknown
TTL remaining: 55
TOS flags: none set

2. Test Download
Actual data bytes sent: 1024001
Actual data packets: 713
Max packet sent (MTU): 1492
Max packet recd (MTU): 1492
Retransmitted packets: 0
sacks you sent: 4
pushed data pkts: 38
data transmit time: 4.189 secs
our max idletime: 242.7 ms
transfer rate: 220964 bytes/sec
transfer rate: 1767 kbits/sec
transfer efficiency: 100%

If you can "see" and provide me with a logical explanation, I'd be MORE than happy to hear it!

trogers · Post by **trogers** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:25 am

RWIN changes value due to the autotuning function of Vista. Latency to that specific website may be changing due to varying network conditions as seen in the uneven ping times of your earlier tracert at hops 7 and 8.