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Thread: Re: Fanboi's lament - falling out of love with the iPad

  1. #1
    Jeff Liebermann
    Guest

    Re: Fanboi's lament - falling out of love with the iPad

    On Sun, 30 May 2010 10:45:39 -0700, John Navas
    <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

    >>- Eyesight problems and older users: The average teenager has no
    >>problems running a web browser on a cell phone or iPod Touch. The
    >>avereage 50+ year old can't see as well and has problem. Tiny
    >>keyboards and small target areas add to the problem. The iPad screen
    >>is large enough for even the most eyesight challenged user to operate
    >>and with an on screen keyboard (with practice) seems quite usable.

    >
    >1. The excellent 10" LED-backed screen on the Acer Aspire One I'm using
    >to type this is clear and sharp (ClearType enabled and properly
    >configured).


    There were 3 different models of the Aspire One. I've owned all three
    in various screen configurations (8.9", 10.1" and 11.6"). As I
    vaguely recall, the 8.9 and 10.1" models were 1024x600 pixels, while
    the 11.6" model is 1366x768. The 8.9" model was difficult to see. I
    was constantly scrolling vertically in order to see documents and
    applications. Google Earth would complain every time I started it
    that the screen was too small. It was. The 11.6" model is much
    better and more visible. The 16:9 aspect ratio is worthless, except
    that it fixes the shrunken keyboard problem. I could barely type on
    the 8.9" model and had to resort to 2 finger typing. The 10.1" and
    11.6" models are better, but still a challenge. The only one I have
    left runs some strange version of Linux. It's good enough for email
    and web browsing which is also how I would mostly use an iPad. When I
    compared screens, this laptop was one of those I compared. I thought
    it stunk when I tried to play a video.

    >2. I personally need a decent keyboard for email, documents,
    >presentations, annotations, etc. The iPad "keyboard" just doesn't cut
    >it.


    My friend has no plans to use her iPad for document preparation
    (formerly called desktop publishing), Power Point, annotation(?), and
    assorted productivity applications. She might view documents that
    others have emailed to her, but she has no intention of replacing her
    desktop machines primary function with the iPad. More crudely, the
    iPad is best used in conjunction with a desktop (running iTunes).

    Others have mentioned that the iPad is not really intended to be used
    as a general purpose computah. I'm undecided on this and want to
    actually try doing some productivity work on the iPad first. I don't
    expect to run Photoshop, Final Cut, or some monster database manager,
    but perhaps the lesser applications might actually be useful.

    >3. I find a netbook (like this Acer Aspire One) works great in bed (and
    >other odd places), probably because I don't like lying on my tummy,
    >preferring to sit up with a machine on my lap, typing on a real
    >keyboard.


    I don't. The display makes it top heavy where it tends to topple. I
    find myself constantly adjusting the position of the display so that I
    can see it. When I do that, the keyboard to display angle changes, so
    I have to also play with the hinge. The original 2200ma-hr battery
    lasted about 2 hours when new and about an hour after about 6 months
    of use. I now have a bulging 4400ma-hr battery which started at about
    3.5 hrs, and is now down to perhaps 3 hrs. Acer claims that the
    2200ma-hr battery will last 3 hours, but I've never seen it.

    The iPad data sheet claims 10 hrs of battery life. We haven't tested
    that yet, but so far, my friend has been able to go for about 3 days
    of moderate use without a charge.

    >>In my never humble opinion, the best thing about the iPad is the
    >>absolutely gorgeous 1024x768 LCD display. I did a side by side
    >>comparison with my assortment of PDA's, netbooks, laptops, and DVD
    >>players. The iPad display looks the best playing a movie in bed.

    >
    >4. I took this Acer Aspire One across the street to the Apple store, put
    >it side by side with an iPad, and the screen compares pretty well,
    >especially given the huge price difference.


    I beg to differ. Try playing a movie or video.

    >5. I much prefer Windows, because Windows runs the software I need,
    >including Flash, multitasking, etc.


    I prefer Unix/Linux because it's easy to do the things I get paid to
    do, but that's another discussion. Again, I'm not really sure that
    the iPad is usable as a productivity tool. In my never humble
    opinion, it's more an entertainment device or oversized PDA and not a
    general purpose desktop or laptop replacement.

    Yeah, not having Flash is a mistake. Multitasked will allegedly
    appear on OS 4.0:
    <http://www.apple.com/iphone/preview-iphone-os/>

    >6. I typically use my Android mobile in the car, with the audio plugged
    >into the car stereo aux input, playing Internet Radio or Pandora, with
    >Google Maps running at the same time giving me audio turn by turn
    >directions while automatically pausing other audio. When a call comes
    >in, I can take it by Bluetooth, or by speakerphone, with audio likewise
    >automatically paused while the caller comes through the car stereo. And
    >it works on the T-Mobile 3G network. Works a treat. iPad would be a
    >huge step backwards for me.


    Impressive, but all those are audio based applications. The iPad
    could (with multitasking) do all of that but adds the a display
    suitable for control and output. All the stuff you describe would
    need to be setup in advance on your Android as playing with the
    buttons and tiny screen while driving is probably dangerous. With a
    screen that's 4 times larger, you can do all the setup and controlling
    without risking your life. If I had to make the choice of automotive
    entertainment, navigation, and visualization (rear view camera)
    device, it would probably be something built into the 2 DIN rail radio
    slot. 2nd best would be an iPad. last would be a cell phone.

    Incidentally, look at what users are doing with cramming a computah
    and LCD display into vehicles:
    <http://www.mp3car.com/vbulletin/show-off-your-project/>
    Search for your vehicle and see what can be done. Also search for
    "ipad".

    Incidentally, the iPad seems to have voice control:
    <http://www.mp3car.com/vbulletin/ipad-apps-car/141812-voice-control-ipad.html>

    >7. If I should want more computing in my car, a netbook would sit nicely
    >on the seat next to me with no bracket needed.


    I do that when doing site surveys, coverage checks, and transmitter
    hunting. It's dangerous to take your eyes off the road and look at
    the screen when on the passenger seat. Even worse is trying to type.
    Something embedded in the dash or on a pedestal mount (like the police
    favor) is safer.
    <http://www.gamberjohnson.com>
    <http://www.ram-mount.com>
    <http://www.ram-mount.com/NewProducts/AppleiPadMounts/tabid/2614/Default.aspx>

    >I think it's actually almost entirely a matter of cachet, like buying
    >pricey bottled water (more on that below).


    Well yes. Perception is everything. If the public perceives that the
    iPad has more than a utility function, then they will pay the price.
    Per a previous discussion, the Apple products (except for the 13"
    MacBook) came out fairly close to twice the cost of an equivalent Dell
    computah:
    <http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/crud/Mac-vs-PC.xls>
    That's a fairly large premium, but people seem to be more than willing
    to pay the price. That could mean that the competition (Windoze and
    PC's) are somehow inferior, or that Apple products somehow have some
    perceived value (status, style, usability, snob value, bragging
    rights, etc).

    Old story recycled. Once upon a time, I worked for a manufacturer of
    marine radios. One product had problems selling as customers seemed
    to be turned off by something about it. So, we added a large block of
    iron inside, to make it heavier than the competition (Motorola).
    Instantly sales improved. Customers could not decide which was the
    better radio based on technical specifications (they were close) and
    therefore made their decision based on style, looks, and weight (more
    for your money). Like I said, perception is everything.

    >8. This Acer Aspire One has a built-in multi-format card reader.
    >9. This Acer Aspire One has wired Fast Ethernet.
    >10. This Acer Aspire One has 160 GB hard drive.
    >11. This Acer Aspire One has a faster processor.
    >12. This Acer Aspire One has 3 USB ports.
    >13. This Acer Aspire One has printing capability.
    >14. This Acer Aspire One has a webcam.
    >15. This Acer Aspire One has video output.


    Yep. Now how much of the basic function of the iPad is lost by not
    having those? If it really were a productivity machine, I see
    problems. However, if the applications are limited to entertainment
    and personal data (PDA) apps, none of that is really useful. When
    coupled with a desktop with iTunes, most of those features can be
    remotely accessed via Wi-Fi. It would be nice for us nerds to have
    all the technology plus the kitchen sink, but whether it is actually
    useful is debatable.

    >16. Gmail on my Android mobile is tightly integrated with everything
    >else, better than any other device or email service I know of (including
    >Blackberry). iPad (and iPhone) doesn't come close.


    True, but it's coming closer. The new OS 4.0 is suppose to have an
    improved email client. As I mentioned, the existing client is
    seriously lacking. I'll reserve my opinions on email usability until
    after I see the new client.

    >As I wrote earlier, why would anyone rationally buy an iPad when (say)
    >the Acer Aspire One can be had for only $200 (Newegg Memorial Day sale)?


    See my comments on perception is everything. The usual price is about
    $350 for the current model netbooks. Apple is able to sell their
    products for twice that. They can do that because the general
    perception of the Apple products is that they're somehow superior,
    while the general perception of PC products is that they're mostly
    commodity junk (which is often true).

    >Or bottled water in San Francisco, when we arguably have the finest
    >municipal water in the world? Probably for much the same reason. ;)


    Because tap water is PERCEIVED to be inferior. You can throw all the
    water quality resources board reports at the customer, and all the
    Consumer Reports horror stories on bottled water at the buyers, and
    still not convince them that municipal water is even safe, much less
    better. Changing that is not a job for a chemist or biologist. It's
    a public relations problem that SF and other cities haven't bothered
    to address (because they don't consider it important). For the
    curious, I use a PURE water filter dispenser and don't buy bottled
    water.

    --
    Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
    150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
    Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
    Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

  2. #2
    nospam
    Guest

    Re: Fanboi's lament - falling out of love with the iPad

    In article <jhb60618si8psis3eg6doa60rbs4i5cniu@4ax.com>, Jeff
    Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:

    > >2. I personally need a decent keyboard for email, documents,
    > >presentations, annotations, etc. The iPad "keyboard" just doesn't cut
    > >it.

    >
    > My friend has no plans to use her iPad for document preparation


    most people don't create, they consume and that's what the ipad is
    optimized for. that's why a handful of authors sell millions of books.

    > (formerly called desktop publishing), Power Point, annotation(?), and
    > assorted productivity applications. She might view documents that
    > others have emailed to her, but she has no intention of replacing her
    > desktop machines primary function with the iPad. More crudely, the
    > iPad is best used in conjunction with a desktop (running iTunes).


    it doesn't need a desktop computer, other than to initially set it up
    and to do firmware upgrades, however, syncing with a desktop is
    helpful.

    > Others have mentioned that the iPad is not really intended to be used
    > as a general purpose computah. I'm undecided on this and want to
    > actually try doing some productivity work on the iPad first. I don't
    > expect to run Photoshop, Final Cut, or some monster database manager,
    > but perhaps the lesser applications might actually be useful.


    there are some very slick apps already, and more will be coming. it's a
    brand new product. how much windows software was there 2 months after
    windows came out?

    > >3. I find a netbook (like this Acer Aspire One) works great in bed (and
    > >other odd places), probably because I don't like lying on my tummy,
    > >preferring to sit up with a machine on my lap, typing on a real
    > >keyboard.

    >
    > I don't. The display makes it top heavy where it tends to topple. I
    > find myself constantly adjusting the position of the display so that I
    > can see it. When I do that, the keyboard to display angle changes, so
    > I have to also play with the hinge. The original 2200ma-hr battery
    > lasted about 2 hours when new and about an hour after about 6 months
    > of use. I now have a bulging 4400ma-hr battery which started at about
    > 3.5 hrs, and is now down to perhaps 3 hrs. Acer claims that the
    > 2200ma-hr battery will last 3 hours, but I've never seen it.


    three hours? hah. and that's with an extended battery? more bulk and
    weight.

    > The iPad data sheet claims 10 hrs of battery life. We haven't tested
    > that yet, but so far, my friend has been able to go for about 3 days
    > of moderate use without a charge.


    people have been reporting 11+ hours watching video, i.e., heavy use
    and not trying to conserve power.

    open it up, it's two giant batteries and a tiny circuit board. :)

    > >>In my never humble opinion, the best thing about the iPad is the
    > >>absolutely gorgeous 1024x768 LCD display. I did a side by side
    > >>comparison with my assortment of PDA's, netbooks, laptops, and DVD
    > >>players. The iPad display looks the best playing a movie in bed.

    > >
    > >4. I took this Acer Aspire One across the street to the Apple store, put
    > >it side by side with an iPad, and the screen compares pretty well,
    > >especially given the huge price difference.

    >
    > I beg to differ. Try playing a movie or video.


    yep, that's where the ipad display shines, literally.

    > >5. I much prefer Windows, because Windows runs the software I need,
    > >including Flash, multitasking, etc.

    >
    > I prefer Unix/Linux because it's easy to do the things I get paid to
    > do, but that's another discussion. Again, I'm not really sure that
    > the iPad is usable as a productivity tool. In my never humble
    > opinion, it's more an entertainment device or oversized PDA and not a
    > general purpose desktop or laptop replacement.


    there's a huge market for entertainment devices.

    > Yeah, not having Flash is a mistake.


    no it isn't. flash on android turns an otherwise fast browser into a
    very slow browser. also, the frame rate is sometimes very choppy and it
    kills battery life too.

    <http://blogs.forbes.com/velocity/201...rtphones-is-fi
    nally-here-and-it-is-terrible/>

    The Nexus One outperformed the other phones by a comfortable margin
    -- but only when Flash was disabled.

    With Flash enabled, the Nexus One was the slowest of the three phones.

    Speed isn't the only problem with Flash in Android.*A snap review
    from Gizmodo on Thursday pointed out that it's also a huge battery
    drain, and outside of sites specifically optimized for mobile, isn't
    yet all that reliable.

    > Multitasked will allegedly appear on OS 4.0:
    > <http://www.apple.com/iphone/preview-iphone-os/>


    iphone os has multitasked since day one, but only with apple's own
    apps. much of what people want to do in the background was solved with
    push notifications, but not everything. background apps are now
    available to third parties in 4.0, nothing alleged about it.

    > >6. I typically use my Android mobile in the car, with the audio plugged
    > >into the car stereo aux input, playing Internet Radio or Pandora, with
    > >Google Maps running at the same time giving me audio turn by turn
    > >directions while automatically pausing other audio. When a call comes
    > >in, I can take it by Bluetooth, or by speakerphone, with audio likewise
    > >automatically paused while the caller comes through the car stereo. And
    > >it works on the T-Mobile 3G network. Works a treat. iPad would be a
    > >huge step backwards for me.

    >
    > Impressive, but all those are audio based applications. The iPad
    > could (with multitasking) do all of that but adds the a display
    > suitable for control and output. All the stuff you describe would
    > need to be setup in advance on your Android as playing with the
    > buttons and tiny screen while driving is probably dangerous. With a
    > screen that's 4 times larger, you can do all the setup and controlling
    > without risking your life. If I had to make the choice of automotive
    > entertainment, navigation, and visualization (rear view camera)
    > device, it would probably be something built into the 2 DIN rail radio
    > slot. 2nd best would be an iPad. last would be a cell phone.


    an ipad in a car is going to be really nice.

    > Incidentally, the iPad seems to have voice control:
    > <http://www.mp3car.com/vbulletin/ipad-apps-car/141812-voice-control-ipad.html>


    as does the iphone 3gs and presumably the next model.

    > >I think it's actually almost entirely a matter of cachet, like buying
    > >pricey bottled water (more on that below).

    >
    > Well yes. Perception is everything. If the public perceives that the
    > iPad has more than a utility function, then they will pay the price.


    the ipad is among the least expensive of tablets.

    comparing them to netbooks is bogus.

    of course when android tablets start appearing around the same price
    (or more), these critics will be saying how amazing it is. i read that
    the asus eeepad will require a two year cellular contract. hah. yea
    that's gona be super-cheap. not.

    > Per a previous discussion, the Apple products (except for the 13"
    > MacBook) came out fairly close to twice the cost of an equivalent Dell
    > computah:


    nope.

    > <http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/crud/Mac-vs-PC.xls>
    > That's a fairly large premium, but people seem to be more than willing
    > to pay the price. That could mean that the competition (Windoze and
    > PC's) are somehow inferior, or that Apple products somehow have some
    > perceived value (status, style, usability, snob value, bragging
    > rights, etc).


    as noted before, it's flawed.

    > >8. This Acer Aspire One has a built-in multi-format card reader.
    > >9. This Acer Aspire One has wired Fast Ethernet.
    > >10. This Acer Aspire One has 160 GB hard drive.
    > >11. This Acer Aspire One has a faster processor.
    > >12. This Acer Aspire One has 3 USB ports.
    > >13. This Acer Aspire One has printing capability.
    > >14. This Acer Aspire One has a webcam.
    > >15. This Acer Aspire One has video output.

    >
    > Yep. Now how much of the basic function of the iPad is lost by not
    > having those? If it really were a productivity machine, I see
    > problems. However, if the applications are limited to entertainment
    > and personal data (PDA) apps, none of that is really useful. When
    > coupled with a desktop with iTunes, most of those features can be
    > remotely accessed via Wi-Fi. It would be nice for us nerds to have
    > all the technology plus the kitchen sink, but whether it is actually
    > useful is debatable.


    it's not targeted at nerds. it's targeted ad normal people who don't
    care about cpu speed, number of usb ports or the rest.

    > >16. Gmail on my Android mobile is tightly integrated with everything
    > >else, better than any other device or email service I know of (including
    > >Blackberry). iPad (and iPhone) doesn't come close.

    >
    > True, but it's coming closer. The new OS 4.0 is suppose to have an
    > improved email client. As I mentioned, the existing client is
    > seriously lacking. I'll reserve my opinions on email usability until
    > after I see the new client.


    wise move.

    android/gmail integration is excellent, but that's not surprising. it's
    when you don't have gmail that android is not so hot.

    > >As I wrote earlier, why would anyone rationally buy an iPad when (say)
    > >the Acer Aspire One can be had for only $200 (Newegg Memorial Day sale)?

    >
    > See my comments on perception is everything. The usual price is about
    > $350 for the current model netbooks. Apple is able to sell their
    > products for twice that.


    and with far better specs, not to mention that the macbook is not a
    netbook.

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