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Thread: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

  1. #41
    Justin
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    nospam wrote on [Wed, 26 May 2010 09:41:38 -0700]:
    > In article <k7dqv5pab9vup4otq4od82ed07qd471fve@4ax.com>, Paul Miner
    > <pminer@elrancho.invalid> wrote:
    >
    >> Actually, announcements are the epitome of vaporware. Nearly all
    >> vaporware starts with an announcement. A software product stops being
    >> vaporware when it actually becomes available. Announcements !=
    >> available.

    >
    > it *has* shipped, to developers, four versions so far. it's not vapor.
    > developers are using it and developing for it. the public release will
    > be soon, probably about two weeks.


    I guess you don't understand whatr shipped means.

    shipped means delivere to consumers

  2. #42
    Justin
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    nospam wrote on [Wed, 26 May 2010 09:41:44 -0700]:
    > In article <s4hqv5pdnj1gs1ocdar10fdg63oohgmlf1@4ax.com>, John Navas
    > <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
    >
    >> It's vaporware until it's actually released (to everyone) --
    >> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware>:
    >>
    >> Vaporware is a word used to describe products, usually computer
    >> hardware or software, not released on the date announced by their
    >> developer...

    >
    > not that wikipedia is a good reference, but according to that
    > definition, it's not vapor since the ship date announced is 'summer
    > 2010.'
    >
    > as i said, it has shipped, to developers. they're using it right now.
    >
    > meanwhile, android 2.2 is vapor. motorola said 'soon' for the droid.
    > not even a date. other devices might not ever get it.


    No, 2.2 has shipped to consumers. It is being deployed right now to Nexus One owners


  3. #43
    Justin
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    nospam wrote on [Wed, 26 May 2010 10:32:43 -0700]:
    > In article <f0mqv5920dnd7odg242l5bv4nbldc2k21i@4ax.com>, Paul Miner
    > <pminer@elrancho.invalid> wrote:
    >
    >> The key word is 'announced'. It's vapor until it ships.

    >
    > it *has* shipped. anyone who wants it can sign up as a developer and
    > get a beta version. the public release is imminent.
    >
    > but if you want to call it vapor, android 2.2 is also vapor, and even
    > more so.


    Can an end user get android 2.2? Yes. Can an end user get iPhone OS 4? No.


  4. #44
    Steve Fenwick
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In article <i8lqv599av527mfj61o7clmft1fni8bm9n@4ax.com>,
    Paul Miner <pminer@elrancho.invalid> wrote:

    > What could possibly justify very, very few 3 year old i* devices being
    > still in use? If true, that's not good for anyone, including Apple.


    Huh? 3 year old iPhones (1st gen) may work just fine. Not as fast as new
    ones, but still better than many alternatives. Less waste for the
    landfill sounds like a decent reason.

    Steve

    --
    steve <at> w0x0f <dot> com
    "Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of
    arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to
    skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, sidecar in the other, body thoroughly
    used up, totally worn out and screaming "WOO HOO what a ride!"

  5. #45
    nospam
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In article <htjmit$vnv$1@news.eternal-september.org>, Justin
    <nospam@insightbb.com> wrote:

    > 3 years isn't very old for an mp3 player.


    doesn't matter, there aren't enough of them out there to bother
    supporting. it's about 3-4% of the install base.

  6. #46
    nospam
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In article <htjmno$vnv$3@news.eternal-september.org>, Justin
    <nospam@insightbb.com> wrote:

    > No, 2.2 has shipped to consumers. It is being deployed right now to Nexus One owners


    *only* nexus one owners, because it's a google product, and officially
    it hasn't actually shipped. some people managed to get a prerelease
    version.

    motorola droid users can't get it yet. t-mobile g1 users can't ever get
    since it won't work on that hardware, ever.

    android 2.2 is vapor too.

  7. #47
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In alt.cellular.verizon John Navas <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
    >
    > I think it's essentially a control (and revenue) issue -- Steve is
    > determined to control all things Apple, and Adobe software (not only
    > Flash, but also products like Photoshop) has always threatened that
    > control (and revenue) -- Flash is just the biggest threat at the moment.


    You are a thinker, but you didn't check did you? ;-)

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse

    Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

  8. #48
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In alt.cellular.verizon nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
    > In article <864ovbFsdlU4@mid.individual.net>, Thomas T. Veldhouse
    > <veldy71@gmail.com> wrote:
    >
    >> > more importantly, not all devices will run android 2.2, including the
    >> > t-mobile g1 which is currently being sold, *new*, right *now*.

    >>
    >> Not all iPods that run 3.1.x will run 4.0 either. Only iPod Touch Gen 3 and
    >> iPhone GS models (not sure about any previous iPhone model) will accept OS
    >> 4.0.

    >
    > all 2nd and 3rd gen ipod touches and the iphone 3g and 3gs can run 4.0,
    > plus whatever is released this year.


    The last thing I read is that 2nd gen iPod Touch is NOT supported. However,
    they seem to have changed it and you are correct.

    "iPhone OS 4 will work with iPhone 3G, iPhone 3GS, and the second- and
    third-generation iPod touch this summer, and with iPad in the fall. Not all
    features are compatible with all devices. For example, multitasking is
    available only with iPhone 3GS and the third-generation iPod touch (32GB and
    64GB models from late 2009)."

    So, multitasking will not be available on 2nd generation iPod Touches or older
    iPhone models; perhaps that is what I was remembering. FULL support is only
    for the iPod Touch Gen 3 and iPhone 3GS.

    >
    > only the 1st gen ipod touch and original iphone cannot. they're 3 year
    > old devices and very, very few are still in use.
    >


    > compare that with android devices that are shipping *now* that can't
    > ever run 2.2, and some that won't run it for a while, whenever the
    > manufacturer decides it will update it.


    Apple sells hardware and software together. Google sells [or gives] their
    operating system away for free and leaves it's source open. So, what they
    risk is a bad reputation from a widespread product that uses it [say that
    Verizon sells a phone that is wildly popular and turns out to be a total dud
    after six months due to the way they integrated the OS ... that could damage
    the Android reputation even if it isn't the fault of the OS; I think that is,
    at least in part, why Apple keeps it's hardware and OS closed].

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse

    Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

  9. #49
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In alt.cellular.verizon Paul Miner <pminer@elrancho.invalid> wrote:
    > On Wed, 26 May 2010 09:41:33 -0700, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
    > wrote:
    >
    >>In article <864ovbFsdlU4@mid.individual.net>, Thomas T. Veldhouse
    >><veldy71@gmail.com> wrote:
    >>
    >>> > more importantly, not all devices will run android 2.2, including the
    >>> > t-mobile g1 which is currently being sold, *new*, right *now*.
    >>>
    >>> Not all iPods that run 3.1.x will run 4.0 either. Only iPod Touch Gen 3 and
    >>> iPhone GS models (not sure about any previous iPhone model) will accept OS
    >>> 4.0.

    >>
    >>all 2nd and 3rd gen ipod touches and the iphone 3g and 3gs can run 4.0,
    >>plus whatever is released this year.
    >>
    >>only the 1st gen ipod touch and original iphone cannot. they're 3 year
    >>old devices and very, very few are still in use.

    >
    > What could possibly justify very, very few 3 year old i* devices being
    > still in use? If true, that's not good for anyone, including Apple.


    That is a very short sighted thing to say. With two-year contracts on these
    devices standard and with the market for such a device spanning as much as a
    year, you have three years of modern support right there. Further, it is VERY
    common for such devices to be passed on to other people for continued use and
    the original person "upgrades". Five years is probably more realistic in my
    opinion.

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse

    Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

  10. #50
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In alt.cellular.verizon Paul Miner <pminer@elrancho.invalid> wrote:
    > On 26 May 2010 14:17:04 GMT, "Thomas T. Veldhouse" <veldy71@gmail.com>
    > wrote:
    >
    > Actually, announcements are the epitome of vaporware. Nearly all
    > vaporware starts with an announcement. A software product stops being
    > vaporware when it actually becomes available. Announcements !=
    > available.
    >


    So, Apple putting out OS 4.0 is vaporware according to the omniscent Novice
    from Silicon Valley with his boat and world record GSM distances ;-)

    If Apple OS 4.0 is only vaporware, than this link is awfully damn risky, don't
    you think?

    http://www.apple.com/iphone/preview-iphone-os/

    No, OS 4.0 is NOT vaporware.

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse

    Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

  11. #51
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In alt.cellular.verizon John Navas <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
    > On 26 May 2010 14:17:04 GMT, "Thomas T. Veldhouse" <veldy71@gmail.com>


    Have we all had enough fun with the triviality of stupid semantics? The whole
    point is that a comparison between 2.2 and the iPod OS needs to include OS
    4.0. Who gives a crap what you call it ... semantics aside, my point is made.

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse

    Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

  12. #52
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In alt.cellular.verizon Paul Miner <pminer@elrancho.invalid> wrote:
    >>
    >>No, that is not what vaporware is.
    >>
    >> http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/vaporware
    >>
    >>Computer Slang. a product, esp. software, that is promoted or marketed while
    >>it is still in development and that may never be produced.
    >>
    >>There is no "may" about it; OS4.0 will be produced and released. Vaporware,
    >>as an example, is TiVo for Comcast [nationwide] and TiVo for DirecTV
    >>[nationwide]. Both have been announced for a long time and the scheduled
    >>release date slips ... in the case of Comcast by many many years now.

    >
    > I guess the part about being "promoted or marketed while it is still
    > in development" escaped you. Did you read what you copied/pasted?
    >


    And what escaped you is the "and". Not to mention it is *slang* which means
    it has no precisely defined meaning. For those that have been around long
    enough to remember when the term vaporware was first used commonly, you know
    very well that Apple's OS 4.0 is not vaporware. But, I cite from
    Dictionary.com again, since semantics are the theme of the day:

    "Computer Slang. a product, esp. software, that is promoted or marketed while
    it is still in development *and* that may never be produced."

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse

    Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

  13. #53
    nospam
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In article <h0sqv5dha71m44kckja59lqctdijs2h0m7@4ax.com>, John Navas
    <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

    > >No, OS 4.0 is NOT vaporware.

    >
    > Until it ships to end users it most certainly *is* vaporware.


    then android 2.2 is vaporware. it has not shipped to end users other
    than a few nexus one users, a phone that sold in very small quantities
    compared to the other android phones, particularly the droid.

    there are probably more iphones running 4.0 betas than android 2.2
    right now.

    can't have it both ways.

  14. #54
    nospam
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In article <865985FubgU6@mid.individual.net>, Thomas T. Veldhouse
    <veldy71@gmail.com> wrote:

    > Have we all had enough fun with the triviality of stupid semantics? The whole
    > point is that a comparison between 2.2 and the iPod OS needs to include OS
    > 4.0. Who gives a crap what you call it ... semantics aside, my point is made.


    exactly. comparing android 2.2 with iphone 3 is ********. android 2.2
    is starting to appear in very limited numbers of devices and iphone os
    4 will appear in a couple of weeks on nearly all devices.

  15. #55
    Paul Miner
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    On Wed, 26 May 2010 10:32:43 -0700, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
    wrote:

    >In article <f0mqv5920dnd7odg242l5bv4nbldc2k21i@4ax.com>, Paul Miner
    ><pminer@elrancho.invalid> wrote:
    >
    >> The key word is 'announced'. It's vapor until it ships.

    >
    >it *has* shipped. anyone who wants it can sign up as a developer and
    >get a beta version. the public release is imminent.
    >
    >but if you want to call it vapor, android 2.2 is also vapor, and even
    >more so.


    Agreed. The definition of vapor applies universally. Both are
    vaporware until they ship, and "to developers" doesn't count.

    --
    Paul Miner

  16. #56
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In alt.cellular.verizon John Navas <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
    > On 26 May 2010 18:27:19 GMT, "Thomas T. Veldhouse" <veldy71@gmail.com>
    > wrote in <8657g7FubgU2@mid.individual.net>:
    >
    >>In alt.cellular.verizon John Navas <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
    >>>
    >>> I think it's essentially a control (and revenue) issue -- Steve is
    >>> determined to control all things Apple, and Adobe software (not only
    >>> Flash, but also products like Photoshop) has always threatened that
    >>> control (and revenue) -- Flash is just the biggest threat at the moment.

    >>
    >>You are a thinker, but you didn't check did you? ;-)

    >
    > "I would like to take you seriously,
    > but to do so would affront your intelligence."
    > {William F. Buckley, Jr]


    A lot of words when you could have just said "No".

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse

    Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

  17. #57
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In alt.cellular.verizon John Navas <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
    >
    > Until it ships to end users it most certainly *is* vaporware.


    Since it exists and is not simply an idea in the vapor, I respectfully
    disagree. If you want to claim victory; it really doesn't matter to me as the
    issue, as I said is one of semantics. The real issue is comparing the correct
    software platforms.

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse

    Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

  18. #58
    Paul Miner
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    On 26 May 2010 18:57:09 GMT, "Thomas T. Veldhouse" <veldy71@gmail.com>
    wrote:

    >In alt.cellular.verizon John Navas <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
    >> On 26 May 2010 14:17:04 GMT, "Thomas T. Veldhouse" <veldy71@gmail.com>

    >
    >Have we all had enough fun with the triviality of stupid semantics? The whole
    >point is that a comparison between 2.2 and the iPod OS needs to include OS
    >4.0. Who gives a crap what you call it ... semantics aside, my point is made.


    Yes, but for the record, your point was thoroughly discredited.

    --
    Paul Miner

  19. #59
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In alt.cellular.verizon nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
    > In article <h0sqv5dha71m44kckja59lqctdijs2h0m7@4ax.com>, John Navas
    > <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
    >
    >> >No, OS 4.0 is NOT vaporware.

    >>
    >> Until it ships to end users it most certainly *is* vaporware.

    >
    > then android 2.2 is vaporware. it has not shipped to end users other
    > than a few nexus one users, a phone that sold in very small quantities
    > compared to the other android phones, particularly the droid.
    >
    > there are probably more iphones running 4.0 betas than android 2.2
    > right now.
    >
    > can't have it both ways.


    I am sure he can argue semantics and warp it to his desired result. The
    simple facts are that android 2.2 will be compared to Apple OS 4.0
    (iPhone,iPod,iPad). Vaporware be damned.

    Notice the novice never even noticed the removal of his so self-important
    cingular group from this part of the thread :-) I am sure he thinks that more
    important than the actual debate little enough playing games of semantics and
    will reply to this message just so he can add it back in :-)

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse

    Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

  20. #60
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: 7 Ways Android 2.2 Froyo Tops Apple's iPhone

    In alt.cellular.verizon John Navas <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
    > On 26 May 2010 18:57:09 GMT, "Thomas T. Veldhouse" <veldy71@gmail.com>
    > wrote in <865985FubgU6@mid.individual.net>:
    >
    >>In alt.cellular.verizon John Navas <jnspam1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
    >>> On 26 May 2010 14:17:04 GMT, "Thomas T. Veldhouse" <veldy71@gmail.com>

    >>
    >>Have we all had enough fun with the triviality of stupid semantics? The whole
    >>point is that a comparison between 2.2 and the iPod OS needs to include OS
    >>4.0. Who gives a crap what you call it ... semantics aside, my point is made.

    >
    > You declare victory just like Dubya, and with just as much validity. :D


    I didn't declare any victory. I said simply that android 2.2 will be compared
    to apple's OS 4.0 and historically that will be the only comparison of meaning
    [any comparison to 3.1 is pretty much pointless]. If you call that victory,
    then I guess so. I call it getting back on point.

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse

    Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.

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