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mansfield
02-13-00, 08:54 PM
What are the advantages and disadvantages of each of these CPUs. I am looking at upgrading my computer and want to buy the best board and cpu. I currently have a Pentium III 500 Mhz with 384 Mbyte Ram.

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Michael

Battleship
02-13-00, 09:07 PM
Ummm, and why do you want to upgrade that? There has got to be something else you can spend your money on. Can I buy your 500 chip? hehe I can probably get it to work at around 700mhz.

cableboy
02-13-00, 10:54 PM
Ok, there are several things to think about. Are you going to try to do any overclocking, or just leave the cpu the way it is? AMD is making the newer athlons hard to clock. You have crack open the chip itself and solder. I believe that they will be coming out with boards soon that have some type of multip... I'll just stop there cause I am not really a hardcore OC'er, get someone like brent to help you in that department. On the other side the Athlons are cheap (in cost) compared to the PIII's of the same Mhz. Athlons have a better l2 cache, which will hopefully be taken advantage of in the coming years of software developement. One disadvantage of getting an Athlon is trying to find the right mobo; and the chips are very picky as to what power supply they are working with. There is much, much more to cover on this topic, but I'm sure some friends will help me out.

cb


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[This cableboy has been edited by message (edited 00-00-2000).]

glussier
02-14-00, 01:00 AM
Where have you taken your info. as to the Athlon having a better L2 cache? As far as I know the Athlon L2 cache is quite slow compared to the PIII-E processors.

cableboy
02-14-00, 06:30 AM
Well, is he looking for a PIII or a PIII E? What I assertained from his question is PIII vs Athlon. Here is a quote from Intel:

Versions that incorporate 256 KB Advanced Transfer Cache (on-die, full-speed level 2 (L2) cache with Error Correcting Code (ECC) or versions that incorporate a discrete, half-speed, 512 KB in package L2 cache with ECC.


All Athlons have a 512 l2 cache, it is a standard. If mansfield is looking for the best of the two and we can bring in other specific processors into the conversation other than the ones he was asking for, then I say:

Mansfield you should go with a 900 Mhz Kryotec Athlon, which actually runs at 1 Ghz, and has a standard l2 cache of 512.

The Kryotech Athlon:

http://www.angelfire.com/de/johns/900.jpg

The inside of the Kryotech Athlon:

http://www.angelfire.com/de/johns/inside.jpg

Quake 3 with the old Kryotech Athlon:

http://www.angelfire.com/de/johns/q3.gif

More:

http://www.angelfire.com/de/johns/sys98win98.gif <-- Doesn't want to come up, click it to learn...

http://www.angelfire.com/de/johns/sys98winnt.gif

"LAS VEGAS, NV--JANUARY 6, 2000--KryoTech, AMD and Compaq Computer Corp. today demonstrated a 1 Gigahertz (1000Mhz) Compaq Presario Internet PC powered by the AMD Athlonô processor and KryoTech SuperGô technology. The Presario PC features innovative technology that enables the system to reach the 1 GHz mark and offers leading edge system performance. The demonstration is being held at the Winter Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in the Digital Living Room, North Hall, at Compaq's Booth # 6653.

The 1GHz Compaq Presario PC demonstration is based on KryoTech's SuperG technology, a "super-cooled" computer featuring an AMD Athlon processor. To achieve this speed, KryoTech's patented cooling system thermally accelerates the AMD Athlon processor, enabling the processor to run at 1GHz, or one billion cycles per second.

"By combining a powerful AMD Athlon processor with KryoTech's patented cooling system, Compaq is able to be the first major computer manufacturer in the world to publicly demonstrate a 1GHz system," said Mark Vena, Director, Consumer Desktop Product Marketing, Compaq Computer Corporation. "The rich combination of Compaq Presario desktop technology using an AMD Athlon processor and KryoTech's innovative SuperG cooling solution provides a glimpse into what the future holds for consumers who desire incredibly powerful personal computer systems."

"KryoTech redefined the performance metric for personal computing with the introduction of the SuperG, the first PC that broke the 1GHz barrier," said Dennis Peck, SVP Sales at KryoTech. "With forward thinking companies like AMD and Compaq on our side, we will set new standards for PC manufacturers, and computer users worldwide will reap the benefits. We're saying goodbye to the Megahertz world and "Welcome to the Gig!"

"The combination of the super cool KryoTech SuperG technology with the lightning fast AMD Athlon processor allows Compaq to demonstrate the technology of tomorrow today," said Dana Krelle, vice president of Marketing for AMD's Computation Products Group.

The 1 GHz Compaq Presario system is based on KryoTech's SuperG technology and demonstrates leading-edge integer, floating point, 3D and multimedia performance. The system also provides the extensive bus bandwidth that will be required for next-generation applications, including: Internet and e-commerce, digital content creation, scientific imaging and graphics, entertainment and extreme gaming, and advanced engineering applications."


there.

cb



[This message has been edited by cableboy (edited 02-14-2000).]

Pen
02-14-00, 07:48 PM
Check mate!

http://www.speedguide.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

mansfield
02-14-00, 08:21 PM
Thanks everyone for the fine info. While I am not obsessed with having the best and fastest computer, I do want to stay on the cutting edge. I think all of the info I have received so far will help me at decision time.

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Michael

Axgrinder
02-14-00, 08:51 PM
Way to go cableboy, but you did'nt slam the door, you nailed it shut. Mansfield as of 2-1-00 the two cpu's compaired closely enough, the trade offs did'nt arouse supporters on eather to jump ship, the afore mentioned kryotech in jan raised alot of eyebrows, but that system is for hitek junkies & tweakers. AMD just recently improved their K7 processor alot like Intel's PIII, the afore mentioed on chip L2 Ect... After release of the 2nd gen K7 people realized the Oc potential of this chip, on average with standard cooling 200-275Mhz increase, 200Mhz without noticeable temp increase, now their companys like ninjamicro that produce add on cpu inhancers which can take a K7 500Mhz to 850Mhz w/ standard cooling, YA baby YA!!! on currently available mobo's, but WAIT! Soon the new mobo's with the latest Via 133 chip set will be available with all the bells & whistles and thats when I'll be grinding on a K7, but the best indicator I can offer is, look around at computer buisiness trends,like gateway, dell, compaq Ect... and see who & how many jumped ship! That CPU addon I mentioned is at WWW.ninjamicro.co.uk (http://WWW.ninjamicro.co.uk) its worthwhile reading. Good Luck! L8r

cbrridin
02-14-00, 10:00 PM
Perhaps before anyone gets anymore 'overclocked' about this, here are some statements made at www.anandtech.com. (http://www.anandtech.com.) I quote, "AMD versus Intel Ė The Reality
From the perspective of performance, the Athlon had been falling short of the Pentium III because of the advantage the Pentium IIIís full speed on-die L2 cache gave it in most applications. The choice seemed clear, as long as the price was virtually identical, the Pentium III was the faster overall CPU and was thus the better choice. But after the heated clock speed battle at the end of last year, there were quite a few interesting points that soon became evident to the public when users actually began looking for these 800MHz CPUs.

On a clock for clock basis, the Athlon is on average 30% cheaper than its Slot-1 Pentium III counterpart. The reason for this is apparently because of a shortage of Pentium III processors coming from Intel which has become incredibly stressful on vendors. That 30% figure is an average Ė for some processors the price advantage held by the Athlon is even more. For example, at the time of publication, the cheapest price a Pentium III 650 would go for was around $420 while an Athlon 650 retails for almost half that at $260. The Pentium III 650 costs over 60% more than the equivalently clocked Athlon CPU!

Even Intelís beloved FC-PGA Pentium III, currently available at 500MHz and 550MHz speed grades canít beat AMDís pricing. The lowest price a Pentium III 550E (FC-PGA) can be had for is $270, which is $10 more than an Athlon 650. While the argument can be made that the 550E can be overclocked to 733MHz and beyond, the majority of Athlon 650 owners, with the addition of an overclocking card or a motherboard that supports adjustable FSB frequencies, can easily hit the 750MHz+ mark.

This brings us to the first conclusion about todayís CPU market: while the Pentium III, on a clock for clock basis may perform better than the Athlon, because of chip shortages and the resulting inflated prices of Pentium IIIs, the Athlon is the more affordable CPU.

Assuming that you have a reasonably large budget for your new computer and decide to go with one of the higher clock speed CPUs, finding anything above a Pentium III 733 is next to impossible for most Do-It-Yourselfers. Unless youíre ordering through one of Intelís major OEMs such as Dell, getting a system based on a Pentium III 750 or 800 isnít a realistic option, regardless of how much money you are willing to spend.

On the other hand, we have seen over 40 online vendors that currently stock the Athlon 800 at a hefty cost of around $750 (at the lowest). While $750 is quite a bit to spend on a CPU, the bottom line is, regardless of how big your budget is, you can at least get an 800MHz Athlon whereas finding an 800MHz Pentium III is almost as difficult as getting on the waiting list for this yearís Ferrari F360. (The Ferrari carries about a 1.5 year waiting list so getting a Pentium III 800 shouldnít be that bad, but you get the point.)

Yields on the 0.18-micron Athlons have been wonderful, which is proven by the incredible overclocking potential of the latest Athlon CPUs. There have been reports of 500 and 550MHz parts hitting well above 750MHz, which puts them on-par with Intelís extremely overclockable FC-PGA chips.

There is very little keeping AMD from releasing a 900MHz or even a 950MHz Athlon CPU at this point other that the fact that there is no need for one since Intel has yet to announce anything faster than 800MHz. But judging from their recent trend of announcing processors without actually having the announcement resulting in physical availability of the chips, Intel could theoretically announce a higher clock speed part and force AMD to release the Athlon at 900MHz or above. For this reason, we canít make any statement as to exactly when AMD will introduce the higher speed CPUs, itís all up to when Intelís 866MHz Pentium III is officially announced." Hopefully this is some help.

CBR

cbrridin
02-14-00, 10:08 PM
Perhaps before anyone gets anymore 'overclocked' about this, here are some statements made at www.anandtech.com. (http://www.anandtech.com.) I quote, "AMD versus Intel Ė The Reality
From the perspective of performance, the Athlon had been falling short of the Pentium III because of the advantage the Pentium IIIís full speed on-die L2 cache gave it in most applications. The choice seemed clear, as long as the price was virtually identical, the Pentium III was the faster overall CPU and was thus the better choice. But after the heated clock speed battle at the end of last year, there were quite a few interesting points that soon became evident to the public when users actually began looking for these 800MHz CPUs.

On a clock for clock basis, the Athlon is on average 30% cheaper than its Slot-1 Pentium III counterpart. The reason for this is apparently because of a shortage of Pentium III processors coming from Intel which has become incredibly stressful on vendors. That 30% figure is an average Ė for some processors the price advantage held by the Athlon is even more. For example, at the time of publication, the cheapest price a Pentium III 650 would go for was around $420 while an Athlon 650 retails for almost half that at $260. The Pentium III 650 costs over 60% more than the equivalently clocked Athlon CPU!

Even Intelís beloved FC-PGA Pentium III, currently available at 500MHz and 550MHz speed grades canít beat AMDís pricing. The lowest price a Pentium III 550E (FC-PGA) can be had for is $270, which is $10 more than an Athlon 650. While the argument can be made that the 550E can be overclocked to 733MHz and beyond, the majority of Athlon 650 owners, with the addition of an overclocking card or a motherboard that supports adjustable FSB frequencies, can easily hit the 750MHz+ mark.

This brings us to the first conclusion about todayís CPU market: while the Pentium III, on a clock for clock basis may perform better than the Athlon, because of chip shortages and the resulting inflated prices of Pentium IIIs, the Athlon is the more affordable CPU.

Assuming that you have a reasonably large budget for your new computer and decide to go with one of the higher clock speed CPUs, finding anything above a Pentium III 733 is next to impossible for most Do-It-Yourselfers. Unless youíre ordering through one of Intelís major OEMs such as Dell, getting a system based on a Pentium III 750 or 800 isnít a realistic option, regardless of how much money you are willing to spend.

On the other hand, we have seen over 40 online vendors that currently stock the Athlon 800 at a hefty cost of around $750 (at the lowest). While $750 is quite a bit to spend on a CPU, the bottom line is, regardless of how big your budget is, you can at least get an 800MHz Athlon whereas finding an 800MHz Pentium III is almost as difficult as getting on the waiting list for this yearís Ferrari F360. (The Ferrari carries about a 1.5 year waiting list so getting a Pentium III 800 shouldnít be that bad, but you get the point.)

Yields on the 0.18-micron Athlons have been wonderful, which is proven by the incredible overclocking potential of the latest Athlon CPUs. There have been reports of 500 and 550MHz parts hitting well above 750MHz, which puts them on-par with Intelís extremely overclockable FC-PGA chips.

There is very little keeping AMD from releasing a 900MHz or even a 950MHz Athlon CPU at this point other that the fact that there is no need for one since Intel has yet to announce anything faster than 800MHz. But judging from their recent trend of announcing processors without actually having the announcement resulting in physical availability of the chips, Intel could theoretically announce a higher clock speed part and force AMD to release the Athlon at 900MHz or above. For this reason, we canít make any statement as to exactly when AMD will introduce the higher speed CPUs, itís all up to when Intelís 866MHz Pentium III is officially announced." Hopefully this is some help.

CBR