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View Full Version : WDS between Draytek Vigor2600g and APExt



deano
04-10-07, 12:44 PM
Hi.

Have been trawling the discussion boards, phoned Draytek and phoned
Apple.
Both companies have told me that it is possible to set up the above
but can't
send me to a page of specific instructions.

Draytek can't support Apple products, and vice versa, "but, it can be
done!" they
both said!

My Vigor 2600g wireless router currently handles my internet
connection and feeds
that to all my wireless clients in the house. But there are black
spots that I wan't to
bring into the zone.

I bought a new Extreme Base Station and an Express Base Station. The
Ext to give
me better coverage, and the Exp to also extend the zone and feed
airtunes to some
speakers in the kitchen ceiling.

Rather than hardwiring my Ext in to my Vigor and getting netconn that
way, I read about
WDS and saw that both the Ext and Vigor support it. That would be a
great solution, as it
would not make the WLAN side of my vigor redundant. I could use this
in addition to the
extended network provided by the Ext and Exp.

Does anyone have setup details that would enable me to get this up and
running? Details
for doing this with any WDS enabled non-apple router would also
provide me with some
clues.

Many thanks,
Dean.

Odie Ferrous
04-10-07, 01:39 PM
deano wrote:
>
> Hi.
>
> Have been trawling the discussion boards, phoned Draytek and phoned
> Apple.
> Both companies have told me that it is possible to set up the above
> but can't
> send me to a page of specific instructions.
>
> Draytek can't support Apple products, and vice versa, "but, it can be
> done!" they
> both said!
>
> My Vigor 2600g wireless router currently handles my internet
> connection and feeds
> that to all my wireless clients in the house. But there are black
> spots that I wan't to
> bring into the zone.
>
> I bought a new Extreme Base Station and an Express Base Station. The
> Ext to give
> me better coverage, and the Exp to also extend the zone and feed
> airtunes to some
> speakers in the kitchen ceiling.
>
> Rather than hardwiring my Ext in to my Vigor and getting netconn that
> way, I read about
> WDS and saw that both the Ext and Vigor support it. That would be a
> great solution, as it
> would not make the WLAN side of my vigor redundant. I could use this
> in addition to the
> extended network provided by the Ext and Exp.
>
> Does anyone have setup details that would enable me to get this up and
> running? Details
> for doing this with any WDS enabled non-apple router would also
> provide me with some
> clues.
>
> Many thanks,
> Dean.

Dean,


Zen Internet directly support Macs and also, I believe, the Draytek
modems.

I'm sure a call to their *very* friendly tech support team could produce
the instructions - if they aren't on their website already.


Odie
--
Retrodata
www.retrodata.co.uk
Globally Local Data Recovery Experts

deano
04-10-07, 02:36 PM
Odie,

Thanks for the heads up. I'll go that way forth and
see what they have to say.

Cheerz,
Dean

Elliott Roper
04-10-07, 04:06 PM
In article <1176233766.680514.152930@8g2000cwh.googlegroups.com>, deano
<deano@yesits.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

> Odie,
>
> Thanks for the heads up. I'll go that way forth and
> see what they have to say.

zen are not as gung-ho on Draytek as they once were. I'm on zen, with a
Draytek 2800 (not G) I hardwired the Draytek to a nearby (6" away)
airport express and used it as the master unit for bridging a swarm
(well OK 2 more) of other expresses lurking near amplifiers in other
bits of the house. So I guess my experience puts an upper (£55) bound
on your exposure to any incompatibility between Draytek and Airport.

--
To de-mung my e-mail address:- fsnospam$elliott$$
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deano
04-10-07, 05:00 PM
I'm going from pillar to post here...

Until I get a categorical "no", I believe this can be done. It's just
a matter
of putting the right settings in the right place... surely it's a
matter of getting
the vigor to pass it's internet access onto the extreme, via WDS
rather than
a wire connected to the ethernet or WAN ports!?

I am getting the feeling that the answer is in the IP addresses,
rather than
the MAC addresses.

Can you expand? I've tried so many configs I'm starting to wonder if
I'm
repeating what I've already tried!!!

cheerz,
d.

> zen are not as gung-ho on Draytek as they once were. I'm on zen, with a
> Draytek 2800 (not G) I hardwired the Draytek to a nearby (6" away)
> airport express and used it as the master unit for bridging a swarm
> (well OK 2 more) of other expresses lurking near amplifiers in other
> bits of the house. So I guess my experience puts an upper (£55) bound
> on your exposure to any incompatibility between Draytek and Airport.
>
> --
> To de-mung my e-mail address:- fsnospam$elliott$$
> PGP Fingerprint: 1A96 3CF7 637F 896B C810 E199 7E5C A9E4 8E59 E248

Martin²
04-10-07, 09:35 PM
I have 2600VG and I don't believe it supports WDS, but there may be firmware
available ?
I suggest you go to www.seg.co.uk follow the links top support, FAQ and the
forum to find your answers.
Regards,
Martin

D
04-11-07, 03:55 AM
On Apr 10, 8:36 pm, "deano" <d...@yesits.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
> Odie,
>
> Thanks for the heads up. I'll go that way forth and
> see what they have to say.
>

Is this any use: http://apx.indusdevelopment.com/

I have the Draytek 2800G and would love to know if you get this
working.

Cheers

David

kev
04-11-07, 04:15 AM
deano wrote:

Details
> for doing this with any WDS enabled non-apple router would also
> provide me with some
> clues.
>
> Many thanks,
> Dean.
>

Non-apple example:-
http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/24308/98/

Tim Auton
04-11-07, 08:24 AM
deano <deano@yesits.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
[snip]
> Does anyone have setup details that would enable me to get this up and
> running? Details
> for doing this with any WDS enabled non-apple router would also
> provide me with some
> clues.

To set up WDS you need to configure one (the Draytek) as a WDS Main Base
Station and the Extreme as a WDS Remote Base Station. This involves
setting the same SSID, channel and security settings, but you also need
to enter the MAC addresses of the other routers in the WDS manually on
each router in the WDS (enter the address off the AE on the Draytek and
vice versa).

For the Airport use Airport Admin Utility to configure it to "Create a
Wireless Network (Home Router)", set up the security[1] the same as on
the Draytek then under WDS tick "Enable this base station as a WDS"
"remote base station" and enter the MAC address of the Draytek in the
box labelled Main Airport ID (or hit Select and pick it from the list).
Tick "Allow wireless clients on this base station" too.

If you tick "Enable Ethernet Port" in "Base Station Options" on the
Express it will also bridge its wired ethernet port to the wireless
network.

For the Draytek the process will be similar, but you'll need to set it
as a WDS Main Base Station and you'll probably enter the MAC address for
the Express into a list of remote base stations.


Tim

[1] You will need firmware version 6.2 or later to use WPA or WPA2 in a
WDS with the Airport Express, older firmware can oly use WEP.

deano
04-11-07, 07:56 PM
As is appropriate on ng's when the OP finally gets the solution to a
problem etc...

Here's how I solved the following...
Setting up WDS between an Airport Extreme base station and a Vigor
2600g wireless router.

(above for easier search string hits).

**Important Warning**
Ensure you have the CORRECT MAC addresses before attempting to set up
ANY WDS!

This turned out to be the most basic problem at the root of my trials
and errors.
The admin pages for the Vigor router config interface does not clearly
announce the MAC address for the WIRELESS point of the device. This is
to be found at the top of the MAIN "Wireless LAN Setup" screen, under
the heading "Wireless Lan Information". Even the guy at Draytek
Premium support was unsure where to find this, when first asked. As
you are easily led to 2 other different MAC addresses on pages
preceeding this, it's easy to assume that one of them is the WLAN MAC
address!

Once I tried this MAC address in the Airport admin utility, I was up
and running within about a minute. The only other thing you need to
focus on between the AEBS and the Vigor, is to ensure that they are
both set to the same channel. Disable all security settings for setup
purposes, you can configure them later, once you have the WDS working.
Also, don't name your AEBS network, the same as that broadcast by the
Vigor (it's easy to assume that this is what you should do). Once the
WDS has been setup, you use the AIBS's airport network... that sent
out by the vigor remains in your drop down list of available networks,
but is not required (unless of course you roam outside of the range of
the AEBS, but are still within that of the Vigor, which you can then
use).

The connection between the AEBS and the Vigor happens beyond your
awareness... they converse via the MAC addresses (or DHCP) and all you
do is work off your newly named AEBS network.

There are many options on the vigor config pages that are indicitive
of having some relevance in setting up a WDS, and it's tempting to
tamper with them when you're running out of ideas...
DON'T... the vigor tech guy stipulated that nothing need be changed
other than entering the MAC address of the peer (AEBS) in the "Bridge"
section of the setup pane, after enabling WDS in "Bridge" mode. That's
it! do nothing else with the Vigor. Everything else gets done in
Airport utility, and that's supported by Apple and the support pages
of the Apple site.

If you've been using your vigor as a wireless router before now,
you'll likely already have IP's distributed around your network via
DHCP and NAT... this remains the same. Your AEBS (or express base
station for that matter) gets its own IP this way. In the Airport
Utility, after setting your BS up to "participate in a WDS network"
and entering the vigor's WIRELESS LAN MAC address into the WDS pane
and the AEBS as a "relay", you then go to Internet Connection and, at
the bottom, set "Connection Sharing" to "off (Bridge Mode)".

I reiterate my first point... Make sure you have the WIRELESS MAC
address of your router.

The rest you should be able to work out, after all, you're a
MacUser :)

deano.

Tim Auton
04-12-07, 06:25 AM
deano <deano@yesits.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
[setting up a WDS network]
> Once I tried this MAC address in the Airport admin utility, I was up
> and running within about a minute. The only other thing you need to
> focus on between the AEBS and the Vigor, is to ensure that they are
> both set to the same channel. Disable all security settings for setup
> purposes, you can configure them later, once you have the WDS working.
> Also, don't name your AEBS network, the same as that broadcast by the
> Vigor (it's easy to assume that this is what you should do). Once the
> WDS has been setup, you use the AIBS's airport network... that sent
> out by the vigor remains in your drop down list of available networks,
> but is not required (unless of course you roam outside of the range of
> the AEBS, but are still within that of the Vigor, which you can then
> use).

On my WDS netwrok, the two routers do use the same SSID (network name).
Only one network appears in the list on a client and clients
automatically select the base station with the strongest signal and
will switch between base stations as required.


Tim

Elliott Roper
04-12-07, 08:19 AM
In article <1176339361.838938.154280@w1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>,
deano <deano@yesits.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

> As is appropriate on ng's when the OP finally gets the solution to a
> problem etc...
Squirrelled away. Thanks.

--
To de-mung my e-mail address:- fsnospam$elliott$$
PGP Fingerprint: 1A96 3CF7 637F 896B C810 E199 7E5C A9E4 8E59 E248

John Navas
04-12-07, 08:53 AM
On Thu, 12 Apr 2007 12:25:10 +0100, Tim Auton
<tim.auton@uton.borg.invalid> wrote in
<mhh1f4-8ue.ln1@nasty.auton.me.uk>:

>deano <deano@yesits.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>[setting up a WDS network]
>> Once I tried this MAC address in the Airport admin utility, I was up
>> and running within about a minute. The only other thing you need to
>> focus on between the AEBS and the Vigor, is to ensure that they are
>> both set to the same channel. Disable all security settings for setup
>> purposes, you can configure them later, once you have the WDS working.
>> Also, don't name your AEBS network, the same as that broadcast by the
>> Vigor (it's easy to assume that this is what you should do). Once the
>> WDS has been setup, you use the AIBS's airport network... that sent
>> out by the vigor remains in your drop down list of available networks,
>> but is not required (unless of course you roam outside of the range of
>> the AEBS, but are still within that of the Vigor, which you can then
>> use).
>
>On my WDS netwrok, the two routers do use the same SSID (network name).
>Only one network appears in the list on a client and clients
>automatically select the base station with the strongest signal and
>will switch between base stations as required.

The selection part will usually work as desired with most wireless
clients, but relatively few wireless clients implement roaming from
access point to access point that way, so it's important to choose an
appropriate wireless client if multi access point roaming is desired.

--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_HowTo>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>

John Navas
04-12-07, 08:53 AM
On Thu, 12 Apr 2007 14:19:30 +0100, Elliott Roper <nospam@yrl.co.uk>
wrote in <120420071419308940%nospam@yrl.co.uk>:

>In article <1176339361.838938.154280@w1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>,
>deano <deano@yesits.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> As is appropriate on ng's when the OP finally gets the solution to a
>> problem etc...

>Squirrelled away. Thanks.

Also archived on Google Groups. :)

--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_HowTo>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>

deano
04-12-07, 03:43 PM
> The selection part will usually work as desired with most wireless
> clients, but relatively few wireless clients implement roaming from
> access point to access point that way, so it's important to choose an
> appropriate wireless client if multi access point roaming is desired.

I did wonder about that. The location manager of X on the mac can
automatically scan for and inform you of alternative networks to join,
if connection to your usual network is lost. But this usually only
happens on wake up or restart etc, and not during normal use, like
wandering round your wireless zone with your laptop. I move from place
to place in my house, with my laptop and, even though my neighbours'
wireless networks, offer stronger signals, in certain spots, my mac
continues to stay faithful to my own WLAN.

On another note, when setting up a string of Airport stations in a WDS
(I have just the one AExtBS and 1 AExpBS), the process ends up
presenting just the one airport network name (that of the main base
station) those of the additional Express(es) [and Extreme(s)]
disappear! It would be useful if there was a utility which showed you
exactly which base station your client was getting its signal from.

deano.

John Navas
04-12-07, 04:11 PM
On 12 Apr 2007 13:43:43 -0700, "deano" <deano@yesits.freeserve.co.uk>
wrote in <1176410623.451867.322720@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>:

>> The selection part will usually work as desired with most wireless
>> clients, but relatively few wireless clients implement roaming from
>> access point to access point that way, so it's important to choose an
>> appropriate wireless client if multi access point roaming is desired.
>
>I did wonder about that. The location manager of X on the mac can
>automatically scan for and inform you of alternative networks to join,
>if connection to your usual network is lost. But this usually only
>happens on wake up or restart etc, and not during normal use, like
>wandering round your wireless zone with your laptop. I move from place
>to place in my house, with my laptop and, even though my neighbours'
>wireless networks, offer stronger signals, in certain spots, my mac
>continues to stay faithful to my own WLAN.

As I recall (but can't easily check at the moment), Intel wireless
software is pretty good at implementing automatic roaming to the access
point with the best signal.

>On another note, when setting up a string of Airport stations in a WDS
>(I have just the one AExtBS and 1 AExpBS), the process ends up
>presenting just the one airport network name (that of the main base
>station) those of the additional Express(es) [and Extreme(s)]
>disappear! It would be useful if there was a utility which showed you
>exactly which base station your client was getting its signal from.

Some wireless software will show multiple access points with the same
SSID together with their MAC addresses. As I recall (but can't easily
check at the moment), Network Stumbler is one such application.

--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_HowTo>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>

circc
05-05-07, 03:57 PM
...

There are many options on the vigor config pages that are indicitive
of having some relevance in setting up a WDS, and it's tempting to
tamper with them when you're running out of ideas...
DON'T... the vigor tech guy stipulated that nothing need be changed
other than entering the MAC address of the peer (AEBS) in the "Bridge"
section of the setup pane, after enabling WDS in "Bridge" mode. That's
it! do nothing else with the Vigor.
deano.

Hi deano, thanks a lot for this description!
As I am trying to do something very similar right now, I am asking your advice:

I want to use my Draytek Vigor 2600GE as a wireless bridge/repeater and a Belkin F5D7230de4 as an access point to extend the range.

I have gathered both devices MAC addresses.

On the Belkin, it's easy to find the "Use as Access Point" item in the menu. I assigned a new IP (192.168.1.254) and restarted. I can now access the Belkin admin web interface on this IP when (LAN-)connected to the Vigor and the Vigor is (LAN-)connected to the Belkin. The Vigor has 192.168.1.1 and is distributing IP addresses 192.168.1.10, .11, .12 etc via DHCP. Both devices use the same channel (6).
Now what I do not know is where on the Vigor I need to enter the MAC address of the Belkin? Circumstances are made difficult also because I have a slovak firmware version (2.5.1_ST) on the Vigor without actually understanding Slovak. Usually I use the English Manual and find my way through the web based admin menu of the Vigor. But I cannot find any mentioning of the Bridge mode in the manual or in the menu.

So right now, I can connect fine to both devices wirelessly (I gave different SSIDs), but only when connected to the Vigor, I get an IP address by DHCP and can connect to the internet. When connected to the Belkin, I cannot connect to the internet and get an IP adress out of the DHCP range (169.254.85.203).

Any advice? Or more specific information on where to enter the bridge mode on the Vigor? Do I need a firmware upgrade?

Thanks...

jamesls
09-06-07, 08:57 AM
deano,

I've also got a Vigor 2600G and would like to extend coverage via WDS using an Airport Express rather than the Extreme - from your experience, any reason why this shouldn't work too?!

Thanks,

James

jamesls
09-12-07, 04:45 AM
Just to update the thread, I got this up and running fine - an Airport Express extending my Draytek Vigor 2600G network via WDS using 128bit WEP. Works very well and is a discreet way of adding WDS bridges to difficult areas of the house (with AirTunes and an Ethernet bridge at each location as a bonus!).

James

NOTGUILTYSTYLE
03-12-08, 06:40 PM
Hi to everyone, I know its maybe a bit off the topic but iv been struggleling for weeks, so would really appreciat if someone could help. I have a netgear WGT624 router which I would like to extend the range of. I want to use the Vigor 2800G wirelessly to do this with.

Fistly I would like to know it this is possible? If So I would greatly apreaciate it if someone could help me.
thanx